WEBVTT 00:00:13.698 --> 00:00:15.698 Today is Thursday, April 17, 2014. We are conducting an interview for the 00:00:18.780 --> 00:00:23.666 Arizona State University Retirees Association video history project. We 00:00:23.699 --> 00:00:27.896 are located today in the ASU Community Services building. I'm Doctor 00:00:27.929 --> 00:00:33.207 Marilyn Mason, now retired from ASU. The technical support staff today 00:00:33.240 --> 00:00:38.116 include Roger Carter on camera, Dave Shatzley, director, and in attendance 00:00:38.149 --> 00:00:46.149 is Linda Van Scooj, chair of the ASURA Video History Project. 00:00:48.598 --> 00:00:55.616 Bob, please introduce yourself. State your name. I'm Robert Bob Francis. 00:00:55.649 --> 00:00:58.737 Bob, can you let our viewers know a little bit about your early life? 00:00:58.770 --> 00:01:06.355 Where were you born and raised? Sure, um. My, my parents, uh, were 00:01:06.388 --> 00:01:10.236 veterans of World War II and met during the war. Uh, my dad was from 00:01:10.269 --> 00:01:15.156 Buckeye, Arizona. My mom was from Southern Illinois, um, so I'm kind of a 00:01:15.189 --> 00:01:23.189 baby baby boomer. I was born in 1946 in Phoenix, um. My parents moved to 00:01:23.739 --> 00:01:30.906 Yuma around 1950, 1952, um, so I grew up in Yuma, Arizona and attended uh 00:01:30.939 --> 00:01:35.986 Yuma High School and following that, Arizona Western College, I graduated 00:01:36.019 --> 00:01:43.135 from Yuma High in '64 and Arizona Western in '66, came up to ASU in '66 00:01:43.168 --> 00:01:48.757 and left with a uh bachelor of Arts degree in education. With a major in 00:01:48.790 --> 00:01:54.516 journalism and minors in history and English in 1969, I taught high school 00:01:54.549 --> 00:01:59.316 for a year at COA High School in Yuma, um, totally enjoyed that experience 00:01:59.349 --> 00:02:07.236 , uh, at that point, um, Don Dotts came down to, um, the high school and 00:02:07.269 --> 00:02:15.269 met with me and. Um, his assistant director for publications had was was 00:02:15.479 --> 00:02:18.686 taking another position, and Don offered that position to me, and I 00:02:18.719 --> 00:02:25.896 accepted, um, thinking I wanted to get out of Yuma, and I wanted to, uh. 00:02:25.929 --> 00:02:31.255 Um, advance my career related to written publication and have the 00:02:31.288 --> 00:02:35.856 opportunity to pursue higher education, um, and everything that Don was 00:02:35.889 --> 00:02:43.889 offering me would, would let me do all those things. 00:02:45.460 --> 00:02:50.827 Can you briefly describe your career here at ASU? 00:02:50.860 --> 00:02:55.427 Briefly, 00:02:55.460 --> 00:02:59.846 sure, yeah, we'll get into details right. I, I started in 1970, um, as the 00:02:59.879 --> 00:03:04.517 editor of Alumni Publications. Um, later I became an assistant director 00:03:04.550 --> 00:03:12.550 for alumni and editor of publications, um. At that, then I moved into 00:03:13.939 --> 00:03:17.946 undergraduate admissions on a part-time basis as an administrative 00:03:17.979 --> 00:03:21.786 assistant while still being the assistant director and editor of 00:03:21.819 --> 00:03:27.386 publications for alumni, um. Undergraduate admissions had just been 00:03:27.419 --> 00:03:32.146 separated from the registrar and admissions office and I moved into um 00:03:32.179 --> 00:03:36.585 student affairs from academic affairs and so I was on the ground floor of 00:03:36.618 --> 00:03:43.146 creating undergraduate admissions uh at that point, um. In undergraduate 00:03:43.179 --> 00:03:48.096 admissions I held a number of titles, most of which related to coordinator 00:03:48.129 --> 00:03:53.946 or assistant director titles for either school relations or orientation, 00:03:53.979 --> 00:03:56.666 um. 00:03:56.699 --> 00:04:02.536 Leaving that position as an executive coordinator in 1997. 00:04:02.569 --> 00:04:09.366 Um, And I left to become the executive coordinator for Greek Life working 00:04:09.399 --> 00:04:13.525 with fraternities and sororities and was in that position till I retired 00:04:13.558 --> 00:04:16.197 in 2002. 00:04:16.230 --> 00:04:19.676 Can you share a little bit about your experiences with um alumni 00:04:19.709 --> 00:04:26.015 association, undergraduate admissions and student development? 00:04:26.048 --> 00:04:30.546 How much time do we have? Um 00:04:30.579 --> 00:04:38.447 The the alumni association really helped me personally, um, determine 00:04:38.480 --> 00:04:43.645 where I was going to end up going with my career, um, and I, I failed to 00:04:43.678 --> 00:04:49.205 recognize it kind of as I was getting into it. I, I came up to the alumni 00:04:49.238 --> 00:04:55.086 association and uh. Uh, at that point, the alumni association had begun 00:04:55.119 --> 00:05:01.546 working with student development or student relations around 1965-966 00:05:01.579 --> 00:05:08.947 and um with um. A network of alumni counselors and teachers and created a 00:05:08.980 --> 00:05:13.717 program called Devil's Advocates and also was giving campus tours and and 00:05:13.750 --> 00:05:17.757 sending devil's advocates out to speak at high schools and so um the 00:05:17.790 --> 00:05:20.395 alumni association was actually kind of the recruiting arm of the 00:05:20.428 --> 00:05:27.476 university at that point um. So I found in addition to working with the 00:05:27.509 --> 00:05:33.116 publications, the person that was working with school relations, um, 00:05:33.149 --> 00:05:40.036 really kind of in uh saw the opportunity for me to enjoy what I enjoyed 00:05:40.069 --> 00:05:43.637 doing and, and I got to accept more responsibility and work with students 00:05:43.670 --> 00:05:48.627 and became adviser to devil's advocates and oversee the the tourist 00:05:48.660 --> 00:05:55.705 program and speaking engagements and um the alumni network program. Um, 00:05:55.738 --> 00:06:01.096 After about 3 years, as I mentioned before, there was a separation between 00:06:01.129 --> 00:06:05.187 the registrar and the admissions office. Uh, uh, registrar stayed in the 00:06:05.220 --> 00:06:10.745 academic affairs area. Uh, admissions moved into student affairs, and at 00:06:10.778 --> 00:06:14.866 that point became undergraduate admissions. Uh, there was a team of about 00:06:14.899 --> 00:06:22.726 3 to 4 people, um. That was brought together to create that office. Uh, 00:06:22.759 --> 00:06:28.166 Joe Norton was the assistant director for admissions under, uh, Alfred 00:06:28.199 --> 00:06:33.645 Thomas, and he moved over to be the director of admissions. Um, Christine 00:06:33.678 --> 00:06:38.245 Wilkinson was moved over from the DM student's office where she was 00:06:38.278 --> 00:06:42.645 employed as an assistant director for student activities. I was brought in 00:06:42.678 --> 00:06:45.887 as an administrative assistant to help with school relations and to help 00:06:45.920 --> 00:06:52.866 with publications, um. And then Dorothy Alexander came over as a secretary 00:06:52.899 --> 00:07:00.899 from, from the uh student affairs area and so we were the primary. Um, 00:07:01.319 --> 00:07:07.007 Staff for undergraduate admissions at that point. 00:07:07.040 --> 00:07:12.967 Then it grew into um from there it just grew. I mean Roger became the dean 00:07:13.000 --> 00:07:19.205 of admissions or dean of undergraduate admissions um Christine was the 00:07:19.238 --> 00:07:26.526 coordinator of orientation um after one year, uh, I was offered the 00:07:26.559 --> 00:07:31.366 opportunity to join the staff on a full-time basis, um, and after talking 00:07:31.399 --> 00:07:38.546 with Don about opportunities and, and, um. I, I made the decision to move 00:07:38.579 --> 00:07:42.546 over to undergraduate admissions and, and work with publications and 00:07:42.579 --> 00:07:47.705 student relations, um, and I was in that area for about 3 or 4 years and 00:07:47.738 --> 00:07:53.786 then Christine became more the director for school relations and I then 00:07:53.819 --> 00:08:00.007 moved into the orientation area and remained the uh. In orientation for 00:08:00.040 --> 00:08:04.486 about 25 years in undergraduate admissions with different titles as I said 00:08:04.519 --> 00:08:12.519 earlier. Um, from Do I move into student development at this point? OK, uh 00:08:12.660 --> 00:08:16.757 , and then in the student development, um. 00:08:16.790 --> 00:08:21.745 Uh, that was also created with a reorganization in the student affairs 00:08:21.778 --> 00:08:28.705 area, um, and so for trains and Shorties, um, they created the executive 00:08:28.738 --> 00:08:34.395 coordinator title. I moved over into that position. Um 00:08:34.428 --> 00:08:37.936 Working with fraternities and authorities as well as the staff of of 00:08:37.969 --> 00:08:43.736 student development which included um student government and the EMU and 00:08:43.769 --> 00:08:46.826 um. 00:08:46.859 --> 00:08:52.706 Community service and some of the other student related activities and I 00:08:52.739 --> 00:09:00.739 was in that position, as I said for 5 years. 00:09:03.719 --> 00:09:07.525 So you were in undergraduate admissions for many years. What was so 00:09:07.558 --> 00:09:11.706 special about admissions? 00:09:11.739 --> 00:09:14.667 Um, 00:09:14.700 --> 00:09:17.696 Admissions were special. 00:09:17.729 --> 00:09:21.986 It, it just had special people and it did special things. I mean, we, what 00:09:22.019 --> 00:09:29.686 we did was fun and what we did, um. Was positive and, and I think we did 00:09:29.719 --> 00:09:37.467 it with good people. um, Christine and Roger hired. Very, um, somewhat 00:09:37.500 --> 00:09:43.346 young individuals who were very energetic, very personable, um, 00:09:43.379 --> 00:09:48.917 hardworking, um. 00:09:48.950 --> 00:09:51.436 Intelligent. 00:09:51.469 --> 00:09:57.846 Um And, and willing to do what needed the extra things that needed to be 00:09:57.879 --> 00:10:04.106 done um when you do that kind of work because a lot of it's uh sometimes 00:10:04.139 --> 00:10:10.356 almost 24 hours a day, um. But, but constant. I mean, you're sometimes you 00:10:10.389 --> 00:10:13.677 , you leave early to go to high schools, you come back late, you have 00:10:13.710 --> 00:10:19.436 evening events and you have weekend activities that that are held and um 00:10:19.469 --> 00:10:24.076 for special activities and orientation programs and so there's just a high 00:10:24.109 --> 00:10:31.927 demand um. I, I think we created a very positive image on the campus, um, 00:10:31.960 --> 00:10:36.846 that we were respected on the campus as well as off the campus by by our 00:10:36.879 --> 00:10:43.236 colleagues and, and high school and community college counselors, um. 00:10:43.269 --> 00:10:51.269 It was just a tremendous experience with great positive people. 00:10:52.908 --> 00:10:56.826 Can you tell us about an achievement of undergraduate admissions and how 00:10:56.859 --> 00:11:04.859 it may have boosted ASU's ability to attract students? 00:11:06.239 --> 00:11:11.635 Uh, at that point, I, I think undergraduate admissions, and I, I don't 00:11:11.668 --> 00:11:16.395 want to give it the full credit, but, um, I, I do think it was at the 00:11:16.428 --> 00:11:22.025 forefront of. Convincing the institution about the value of marketing to 00:11:22.058 --> 00:11:30.058 the university, um. Up up up until That time the the university had kind 00:11:30.719 --> 00:11:37.686 of seen. Itself as, you know, take us or leave us type of thing, um, if 00:11:37.719 --> 00:11:44.038 you wanna come fill out the application, here it is, and that was it, um. 00:11:45.369 --> 00:11:47.369 And I, I believe that with the founding of undergraduate admissions and 00:11:52.330 --> 00:11:55.927 And the marketing that kind of came with that, the personal contacts, the 00:11:55.960 --> 00:12:01.996 , um, the publications that were provided, the programs that that came to 00:12:02.029 --> 00:12:08.086 be, um, working with offices across the campus to accomplish common goals 00:12:08.119 --> 00:12:14.885 , um, recruiting of, of quality students, um, establishing programs to 00:12:14.918 --> 00:12:20.917 recognize, um, outstanding. Characteristics of students, leadership, uh, 00:12:20.950 --> 00:12:24.677 academics, um. 00:12:24.710 --> 00:12:31.407 Special abilities in academic areas, um. 00:12:31.440 --> 00:12:35.206 all these, I, I think. 00:12:35.239 --> 00:12:38.217 Help to 00:12:38.250 --> 00:12:43.775 Convinced people in the administration that the value of marketing um and 00:12:43.808 --> 00:12:50.537 the image of the institution was was very valuable to. to recognizing the 00:12:50.570 --> 00:12:58.570 issue as as people wanted it to be. 00:13:00.869 --> 00:13:04.946 The admissions office, and I think that's what I understand you worked in 00:13:04.979 --> 00:13:10.996 , not registrar but undergraduate admissions. was responsible for 00:13:11.029 --> 00:13:18.557 recruiting now that it came away from alumni. Um, And in that job you had 00:13:18.590 --> 00:13:24.525 , the big job was. Reaching out to high schools and places around the 00:13:24.558 --> 00:13:31.515 country. And you'd put on orientations not only on campus but you'd go out 00:13:31.548 --> 00:13:38.076 maybe to New Jersey or San Francisco did a lot of travel to connect with 00:13:38.109 --> 00:13:42.557 prospective students, is that right? That is, is correct. Uh, you know, in 00:13:42.590 --> 00:13:46.996 , in the beginning, the alumni association primarily did the things that 00:13:47.029 --> 00:13:51.635 worked with school relations. The admissions and registrar's office 00:13:51.668 --> 00:13:56.275 produced a catalog every year and produced admissions applications. And 00:13:56.308 --> 00:14:00.917 that's about it, um, up until admissions were separated and went into 00:14:00.950 --> 00:14:05.196 George Hamm, um, and George decided that we needed to compete more with 00:14:05.229 --> 00:14:10.596 the University of Arizona, uh, to recruit quality students, and then, um, 00:14:10.629 --> 00:14:14.265 the undergraduate admissions office was created and from there just kind 00:14:14.298 --> 00:14:20.436 of blossomed, um, through its programming and, and publications. I mean, 00:14:20.469 --> 00:14:24.917 not all this happened obviously overnight. It, it, it took a period to 00:14:24.950 --> 00:14:31.927 develop and. And create the programs to where they are today. The and 00:14:31.960 --> 00:14:36.446 things just seem to kind of tie together in a lot of ways and particularly 00:14:36.479 --> 00:14:43.025 with admissions, um. And a lot of it made sense and and that's what. Kind 00:14:43.058 --> 00:14:47.467 of created the family atmosphere and the fun part of the program. So I 00:14:47.500 --> 00:14:52.866 mean when when you go out and visit all the high schools every year all 00:14:52.899 --> 00:14:57.297 the colleges in the state line up and all these cars get in a row and they 00:14:57.330 --> 00:15:00.625 go into the high schools and they try and sell the the high school 00:15:00.658 --> 00:15:04.265 students on their institutions well, and then they get in their cars and 00:15:04.298 --> 00:15:08.307 they go to the next high school two hours later. I mean it's just, um, but 00:15:08.340 --> 00:15:12.875 that goes on for probably 6 to 8 weeks. You know, and we didn't have the 00:15:12.908 --> 00:15:16.037 staff to do that, so we had to reach out to people in the university 00:15:16.070 --> 00:15:20.157 community and, and some of them would take a week. The departments would 00:15:20.190 --> 00:15:25.275 allow them to take a week and and travel and represent us and, and, um, so 00:15:25.308 --> 00:15:29.116 we have kind of helped develop a family and collaboration through those 00:15:29.149 --> 00:15:33.047 types of activities, um. 00:15:33.080 --> 00:15:39.246 Don Dots allowing us to to take over the school relations program from his 00:15:39.279 --> 00:15:44.407 office, um, so the people now came to our office for campus tours. Devil's 00:15:44.440 --> 00:15:48.446 advocates were there. They would give the campus tours. Advocates went out 00:15:48.479 --> 00:15:54.486 and spoke to the high schools and and tried to recruit students, um, in a 00:15:54.519 --> 00:15:59.047 subtle way from that perspective, um. We started offering office 00:15:59.080 --> 00:16:02.375 interviews so that students who came to our campus could actually sit down 00:16:02.408 --> 00:16:07.616 with someone and and talk about what to do at at that point advisors 00:16:07.649 --> 00:16:12.326 didn't want to meet with students till they were enrolled um or ready to 00:16:12.359 --> 00:16:17.177 enroll and um there wasn't anyone else to meet with the students and so we 00:16:17.210 --> 00:16:21.775 had parents and family and students just wandering our campus trying to 00:16:21.808 --> 00:16:26.717 figure out what the issue is all about, um. 00:16:26.750 --> 00:16:30.797 From there we moved into minority recruitment, you know, and, and 00:16:30.830 --> 00:16:34.706 recognizing the need for diversity and to represent the university in, in 00:16:34.739 --> 00:16:41.836 , in different ways to different populations and um. Orientation programs 00:16:41.869 --> 00:16:47.196 was a natural fit, um, so that came over from student activities and 00:16:47.229 --> 00:16:55.229 student life, um, with Christine and then, um later publications and. And 00:16:55.928 --> 00:17:02.106 multimedia types of activities, the web and all that was developed and um. 00:17:02.139 --> 00:17:07.295 The parent program was a uh uh once you get into orientation and work in 00:17:07.328 --> 00:17:11.936 school relations, you, you really see that the university needs to also 00:17:11.969 --> 00:17:15.617 meet the needs of parents because they are an important part of the 00:17:15.650 --> 00:17:19.805 decision making process, um, so that became a part of the thing. So 00:17:19.838 --> 00:17:23.467 everything has kind of organization you formed there was a parent 00:17:23.500 --> 00:17:28.676 organization that was formed in uh in our office out of undergraduate 00:17:28.709 --> 00:17:32.097 admissions correct. 00:17:32.130 --> 00:17:36.736 With all the geographic changes ASU has undergone in the past several 00:17:36.769 --> 00:17:42.085 years, it's kind of hard to imagine where did you do your, hold your 00:17:42.118 --> 00:17:48.377 orientation programs. The orientation programs. That was probably one of 00:17:48.410 --> 00:17:54.776 the biggest challenges, um, during orientation, uh, in that, um, we never 00:17:54.809 --> 00:17:58.857 knew where we were going to be kind of from year to year. At that point we 00:17:58.890 --> 00:18:05.776 , we had to make our reservations, um, anywhere from 9 months to a year 00:18:05.809 --> 00:18:12.377 out, um, and in that case, uh, orientation wasn't necessarily a priority 00:18:12.410 --> 00:18:19.426 to the university. Um, so we were always battling, um, other offices and 00:18:19.459 --> 00:18:25.426 for campus space, be it space in the union or be it space in the academic 00:18:25.459 --> 00:18:32.666 facilities. Um, We tried to be in the union as much as possible, um, and 00:18:32.699 --> 00:18:40.377 later as I was leaving the institution, um, I, I we were able to schedule 00:18:40.410 --> 00:18:46.906 um orientation functions pretty much before anyone else, um, just because 00:18:46.939 --> 00:18:51.387 of the size of the programs we, we've grown so much that we, we just 00:18:51.420 --> 00:18:57.585 needed almost orientation every day from April until practically mid July 00:18:57.618 --> 00:19:00.627 to August. 00:19:00.660 --> 00:19:08.285 Were there any particular challenges you encountered during your career? 00:19:08.318 --> 00:19:14.565 Every day was a challenge, um, and that's what made my job fun, um, for my 00:19:14.598 --> 00:19:22.016 job's fun, um. 00:19:22.049 --> 00:19:27.526 Probably the the biggest challenge related to convincing the institution. 00:19:27.559 --> 00:19:35.416 Um, about the value of orientation and um. 00:19:35.449 --> 00:19:39.035 Providing entering new students with information that will help them be 00:19:39.068 --> 00:19:43.835 successful and to navigate the university system during their time on our 00:19:43.868 --> 00:19:49.476 campus, um. 00:19:49.509 --> 00:19:55.226 That was probably an ongoing challenge, um, for the time that I was here, 00:19:55.259 --> 00:19:59.857 uh, about the time I was leaving, I, I sense that, uh, well, Christine had 00:19:59.890 --> 00:20:04.496 become the vice president at that point, and, uh, the value of orientation 00:20:04.529 --> 00:20:09.696 I think was now being recognized around the campus. Um, the, the fact of 00:20:09.729 --> 00:20:15.446 the matter is that orientation probably in the long run. 00:20:15.479 --> 00:20:19.967 Changed but didn't change that much. I mean when I when I left the program 00:20:20.000 --> 00:20:24.686 we still had 22 day programs, so there was overnight programs we 00:20:24.719 --> 00:20:28.166 implemented 1 day programs for transfer students primarily but they became 00:20:28.199 --> 00:20:35.357 popular um we implemented some out of state programs, um. And, and just 00:20:35.390 --> 00:20:38.555 the size of of our programs and the number of students going through the 00:20:38.588 --> 00:20:45.397 university and through our programs increased but. Um, But the philosophy 00:20:45.430 --> 00:20:48.516 behind orientation and and what you're trying to provide for new students 00:20:48.549 --> 00:20:54.795 , I don't think changed from day one to when I left in your career, uh, 00:20:54.828 --> 00:21:00.726 emphasis came down from the upper administration on your activities, uh. 00:21:00.759 --> 00:21:06.456 Who was most involved in directing. The activities of the admissions 00:21:06.489 --> 00:21:13.035 office. George Hamm. was the vice president for student affairs and he was 00:21:13.068 --> 00:21:19.926 the vice president that that. was in office when undergraduate admissions 00:21:19.959 --> 00:21:23.946 began its functioning, um. 00:21:23.979 --> 00:21:29.555 He definitely had a say in undergraduate admissions who was employed, um, 00:21:29.588 --> 00:21:33.627 somewhat how the direction we were going, definitely budget, uh, obviously 00:21:33.660 --> 00:21:38.686 facilities and things like that. uh, I don't think at that point too much 00:21:38.719 --> 00:21:44.065 of that Doctor Schwater was involved too much except to be at occasional, 00:21:44.098 --> 00:21:48.627 um, functions and, and to represent the university to speak it's junior 00:21:48.660 --> 00:21:53.295 day, senior day, those types of things, um. 00:21:53.328 --> 00:21:55.617 Uh, 00:21:55.650 --> 00:22:01.476 Russ Nelson took a little bit of, of a role but not a lot. Um, he truly 00:22:01.509 --> 00:22:08.597 believed in, um, Leadership from the bottom up and and um but but Laddie 00:22:08.630 --> 00:22:12.476 Cos seemed to have a really different approach to things and a different, 00:22:12.509 --> 00:22:16.936 a definite interest and a different vision of of where the institution 00:22:16.969 --> 00:22:20.835 should be going and I, I think how undergraduate admissions could be a 00:22:20.868 --> 00:22:28.868 part of that and um. And under Doctor K, I, I believe, um, the provost's 00:22:29.269 --> 00:22:34.516 office came about and at that point there was more definitely more 00:22:34.549 --> 00:22:41.516 definitely more collaboration. And more work with the uh provost office in 00:22:41.549 --> 00:22:45.785 recruiting of new students, uh, particularly those that of high quality 00:22:45.818 --> 00:22:51.166 and academic abilities, um, all along the lines, you know, the, for 00:22:51.199 --> 00:22:55.035 instance, the dean of students was very supportive of, of us related to 00:22:55.068 --> 00:22:58.835 student activities and programs providing people at orientation things 00:22:58.868 --> 00:23:03.276 like that, as were the academic deans. They would always try and see that 00:23:03.309 --> 00:23:08.226 someone was there to represent their college or. Or their majors uh during 00:23:08.259 --> 00:23:16.259 orientation or during our special days. 00:23:18.930 --> 00:23:22.055 And can you share a few special memories about working with the devil's 00:23:22.088 --> 00:23:25.256 advocates? 00:23:25.289 --> 00:23:27.617 Um, 00:23:27.650 --> 00:23:33.097 Devil Devil's Advocates was the joy of my life in a lot of ways. Um, I, I 00:23:33.130 --> 00:23:37.696 advised that group for close to 25 years, um, starting with the alumni 00:23:37.729 --> 00:23:43.696 association. They already existed when I, uh, began my employment, um, so 00:23:43.729 --> 00:23:50.496 I began advising them around 1971 and basically 00:23:50.529 --> 00:23:58.529 left that position around 1996, 1997, somewhere in that time frame, um. 00:24:00.400 --> 00:24:04.426 They were, they were a group of students that were just because of who 00:24:04.459 --> 00:24:07.867 they were and how they were selected as an organization, they were just 00:24:07.900 --> 00:24:15.065 truly outstanding, dynamic, personable, energetic. 00:24:15.098 --> 00:24:19.285 Group of students that you could ever meet. 00:24:19.318 --> 00:24:23.325 They themselves, I think, were responsible for recruiting thousands of 00:24:23.358 --> 00:24:26.967 students to our university, and, and people may think I'm exaggerating, 00:24:27.000 --> 00:24:34.097 but that's really not the case. Um, they, because of who they were and, um 00:24:34.130 --> 00:24:38.085 , and how they were easily identified, they, they spoke at high schools 00:24:38.118 --> 00:24:42.835 they gave tours of campus to prospective students and their parents. They 00:24:42.868 --> 00:24:49.397 helped with special days on campus, junior days, senior days, all kinds of 00:24:49.430 --> 00:24:56.035 VIP type of days, um, so, so they were totally very visible. They, they 00:24:56.068 --> 00:25:02.476 served in the orientation program. Um, so this, this new students coming 00:25:02.509 --> 00:25:06.357 in the university saw them from the day that they spoke in their classroom 00:25:06.390 --> 00:25:09.236 to when they visited the campus to when they arrived on campus for 00:25:09.269 --> 00:25:14.877 orientation and, and there was just an instant identification and, um, and 00:25:14.910 --> 00:25:22.335 I think a positive experience. Uh The quality of the individuals, the, the 00:25:22.368 --> 00:25:27.117 group was 25 when I started advising when I left, it was, uh, an 00:25:27.150 --> 00:25:31.976 organization of 35 students, so it grew by 10 students over 25 years, but 00:25:32.009 --> 00:25:37.006 , uh, um, they, they were just incredible. 00:25:37.039 --> 00:25:42.776 In that um. Oh, they, they were total leaders. They were dynamic and 00:25:42.809 --> 00:25:48.156 personable, as I said. How did you go about recruiting devil's advocates 00:25:48.189 --> 00:25:54.137 and selecting them? What was that process? 00:25:54.170 --> 00:25:56.666 Uh 00:25:56.699 --> 00:26:02.186 It it's a complex process, but it's fairly simple. Um, nomination form 00:26:02.219 --> 00:26:06.706 nominations were selected were asked by, uh, people from throughout the 00:26:06.739 --> 00:26:11.266 campus to nominate quality students for the organization. They did have to 00:26:11.299 --> 00:26:16.585 have a minimum GPA, not high, but I think it was like a C+ GPA something 00:26:16.618 --> 00:26:22.016 like that, um. 00:26:22.049 --> 00:26:26.936 The selection process itself was a little bit more intense in that all the 00:26:26.969 --> 00:26:31.877 people that were nominated came to a reception and they met members of 00:26:31.910 --> 00:26:37.476 advocates and, um, mixed and mingled in kind of a tea atmosphere and then 00:26:37.509 --> 00:26:40.335 after the reception the advocates would get together and they would 00:26:40.368 --> 00:26:44.835 determine, um, from that reception who would be invited back for 00:26:44.868 --> 00:26:50.647 interviews. And then they would invite people back for um uh round one of 00:26:50.680 --> 00:26:56.397 interviews and there would be um so approximately 60% of those that 00:26:56.430 --> 00:27:01.325 attended the reception would be invited back for an interview, um, you'd 00:27:01.358 --> 00:27:07.766 call it an audition it would be an audition and um, did they have to walk 00:27:07.799 --> 00:27:11.325 backwards? They did not have to walk backwards at that point, but they, 00:27:11.358 --> 00:27:15.776 they did. They walked into a room. Uh, fairly like this, uh, uh, probably 00:27:15.809 --> 00:27:20.776 a small room. There would be 10 to 15 advocates there. Um, each of the 00:27:20.809 --> 00:27:25.256 advocates would ask about 5 questions. The applicant would respond and 00:27:25.289 --> 00:27:31.936 then, uh, leave, and, um, 5 minutes max, um, and then based on that 5 00:27:31.969 --> 00:27:39.555 minutes. Um, about 20% would be invited back. Um, and then from that 00:27:39.588 --> 00:27:45.357 usually about 10% would be selected to join the, the group itself, the 00:27:45.390 --> 00:27:49.276 only, the only people who were replaced in the group were those that were 00:27:49.309 --> 00:27:53.916 choosing to leave the group or, um, graduating from the institution. And 00:27:53.949 --> 00:28:00.315 so if we had a group of 25 and and a graduating class of 10, we would only 00:28:00.348 --> 00:28:07.285 be replacing 10 people, but we might start with 150 people at the T. And, 00:28:07.318 --> 00:28:11.617 and so it, it was just a process of elimination, obviously the, the, the 00:28:11.650 --> 00:28:17.166 cream comes to the top fairly quickly and it's all based on. A lot of it 00:28:17.199 --> 00:28:23.206 is based on because of what they do, uh, first impression. Uh, what are 00:28:23.239 --> 00:28:27.565 the benefits that they would have to stick with the organization, just 00:28:27.598 --> 00:28:33.226 being in front of people and Performing and 00:28:33.259 --> 00:28:39.785 I, I, I, uh, a lot of it, I, I think related to networking, um, amongst 00:28:39.818 --> 00:28:44.065 themselves because they represented all parts of the campus and, and 00:28:44.098 --> 00:28:48.986 therefore particularly younger advocates could be mentored by older 00:28:49.019 --> 00:28:51.785 advocates going into student government, going into fraternities and 00:28:51.818 --> 00:28:58.226 sororities, going into, uh, academic careers, um, going into whatever 00:28:58.259 --> 00:29:01.897 directions they wanted to, there were people there that would. Um, be 00:29:01.930 --> 00:29:05.456 willing to work with them and guide them along those ways. Definitely I 00:29:05.489 --> 00:29:09.617 think there was an ego type of thing involved in there, but in defense of 00:29:09.650 --> 00:29:14.055 that too, I, I think a lot of what they were doing, they already had the 00:29:14.088 --> 00:29:20.377 skills and the personality, uh, to, to meet those qualifications. I mean 00:29:20.410 --> 00:29:26.217 they were just they were truly outstanding and they. Their personalities 00:29:26.250 --> 00:29:34.539 and their dynamic, uh, ability, high energy, um, alpha people all the way.