WEBVTT 00:00:01.018 --> 00:00:09.018 This is Boris Solis interviewing uh Kathleen Walsh on August 12th at 2:30. 00:00:09.089 --> 00:00:15.687 OK, OK, we'll go ahead and get started. So, um, could you maybe just tell 00:00:15.720 --> 00:00:22.546 me a little bit about yourself to kind of get us started here. Um, I grew 00:00:22.579 --> 00:00:28.826 up uh in a military family. Uh my dad retired here to Arizona in the early 00:00:28.859 --> 00:00:35.506 70s. I have three other siblings, but I have to say that during my, most 00:00:35.539 --> 00:00:42.926 of my childhood. Uh, I felt like I was an only child because I felt so 00:00:42.959 --> 00:00:48.366 different from my family and my siblings, and if it wasn't for the 00:00:48.399 --> 00:00:54.125 resemblance, I really thought I was maybe left on the doorstep really I 00:00:54.158 --> 00:00:57.472 just felt very. Very different. I felt different in school. I felt, and 00:00:57.505 --> 00:01:04.391 I'm sure that's with a lot of people, but at that time I didn't have, 00:01:04.424 --> 00:01:09.311 there was no way of uh socially connecting with other people maybe that 00:01:09.344 --> 00:01:15.686 felt the same way. So you did feel pretty isolated. And um so I was pretty 00:01:15.719 --> 00:01:21.995 much uh uh on my own. I did have friends but never I would never form any 00:01:22.028 --> 00:01:27.867 really close attachments because of just the the kind of the gypsy 00:01:27.900 --> 00:01:31.915 lifestyle that we we led I never really got to form any close attachments 00:01:31.948 --> 00:01:37.906 to people because we moved a lot so um that continued on through my um. Uh 00:01:37.939 --> 00:01:45.939 , early teens and um late, well in my adulthood, and I um uh when I could 00:01:46.058 --> 00:01:50.587 , I finally decided that um when I could financially, I finally decided I 00:01:50.620 --> 00:01:57.745 would live on, on my own. I, I can't describe to people how Comfortable 00:01:57.778 --> 00:02:04.786 and how good it feels for me to be by myself. Yet I am human. I do need 00:02:04.819 --> 00:02:11.816 human contact and that's the kind of the, the Oh, what's the word I wanna 00:02:11.849 --> 00:02:18.805 use um. Is conundrum a good word? Because that's what comes to mind that I 00:02:18.838 --> 00:02:23.286 want to be with people, but I don't. It's like I want to be with people 00:02:23.319 --> 00:02:29.297 and when I am, even I do best one on one, always have. Never wanted to be 00:02:29.330 --> 00:02:33.846 in a group of many girlfriends, just wanted to have one girlfriend. I 00:02:33.879 --> 00:02:39.036 don't know where that comes from. I've just always been that way. So when 00:02:39.069 --> 00:02:45.666 I was um A young, uh, in my early twenties, I was living on my own in 00:02:45.699 --> 00:02:51.786 Phoenix, which I love. I would love to come back to live in Phoenix. I was 00:02:51.819 --> 00:02:58.626 with uh friends uh uh casually that you know that we're getting married 00:02:58.659 --> 00:03:02.896 now and you know they were mid-twenties now everybody seemed to be getting 00:03:02.929 --> 00:03:08.467 married. And uh I still didn't want that. I had boyfriends. I never wanted 00:03:08.500 --> 00:03:12.396 to be married. I, when I was younger, I never dreamed about my wedding 00:03:12.429 --> 00:03:16.957 dress. I never dreamed about my wedding. I never. Never. I read romance 00:03:16.990 --> 00:03:22.036 novels, so I mean I, I did have a a feeling of, you know, being with 00:03:22.069 --> 00:03:27.906 someone and having that that that romance but never wanted to be married 00:03:27.939 --> 00:03:34.196 and as I got older into my late twenties, all of a sudden it was the 00:03:34.229 --> 00:03:38.916 biological clock just went, you know, off the, the alarm was going off in 00:03:38.949 --> 00:03:43.017 my head like all the time and I thought. I don't want to be married, and 00:03:43.050 --> 00:03:47.416 it never occurred to me that it was wrong to have a child and not be 00:03:47.449 --> 00:03:53.696 married. It was like, you know, I wanted to have a stable job so I could 00:03:53.729 --> 00:03:58.177 live on my own. I achieved that. I wanted to have my home on my own. I 00:03:58.210 --> 00:04:04.555 achieved that and now I want a child, so I will. And I wasn't thinking, oh 00:04:04.588 --> 00:04:08.835 , I'm just going to go look for somebody to donate some man to donate, you 00:04:08.868 --> 00:04:13.755 know, a sperm donor. I really wanted to be with somebody, but it just, it 00:04:13.788 --> 00:04:20.055 , it, it didn't work out. As far as being married or being um You know, uh 00:04:20.088 --> 00:04:25.336 , uh, finding someone, getting married, that how that progression works. I 00:04:25.369 --> 00:04:33.317 had a boyfriend and uh it just so happened that I You know, uh, over the 00:04:33.350 --> 00:04:37.426 course of like 2 or 3 months, and I think in the back of my head I really 00:04:37.459 --> 00:04:40.995 that's what I really was looking for a sperm donor and I was telling 00:04:41.028 --> 00:04:44.395 myself, oh no, I really would like to be married. I don't want to, you 00:04:44.428 --> 00:04:51.676 know, but anyway, I met her dad and um we dated for a little while and 00:04:51.709 --> 00:04:58.055 then we split up and then I found out I was pregnant and. Um, the doctor 00:04:58.088 --> 00:05:02.877 actually, uh, I didn't seem so excited when, you know, he told me. I 00:05:02.910 --> 00:05:07.745 already knew that I was, and, um, he said, well, you know, do you, do you 00:05:07.778 --> 00:05:11.866 want to continue with this? I said, I almost said no and I said, you know 00:05:11.899 --> 00:05:15.546 what, let me think about it. Let me, let me, I want to think about it. And 00:05:15.579 --> 00:05:19.825 then a week went by, 2 weeks went by, a month went by, I went, oh, it's 00:05:19.858 --> 00:05:26.156 too late. I'm just gonna go ahead and, and, and, um. Uh, I, and once I 00:05:26.189 --> 00:05:31.757 made that commitment, I never really seemed, um, like, uh, like it was 00:05:31.790 --> 00:05:36.395 wrong, like not to be married or and my friends were, and sometimes I was 00:05:36.428 --> 00:05:41.916 envious of that because they had somebody there for them, but I did try to 00:05:41.949 --> 00:05:49.455 get back together with her dad and it it. We lived together after she was 00:05:49.488 --> 00:05:55.226 born, but it lasted maybe a year and then I moved out and she has not seen 00:05:55.259 --> 00:05:59.627 him since she was 18 months. We have not seen him. I don't even know if he 00:05:59.660 --> 00:06:05.846 still lives in Phoenix. haven't had any contact, nothing. 00:06:05.879 --> 00:06:12.236 Wow. Was it a really difficult breakup? It was, yes, it was. And and I Um 00:06:12.269 --> 00:06:15.825 , through the years struggling, they were good, you know, I had, you know 00:06:15.858 --> 00:06:22.796 , fairly good, um, uh, a really good job and, and, um, uh, financially 00:06:22.829 --> 00:06:26.955 sometimes I was OK and so financially sometimes I I wasn't and at those 00:06:26.988 --> 00:06:31.437 times I would think, well, I would like to go to court and. You know, and 00:06:31.470 --> 00:06:36.276 then the thought of, of having that havoc or whatever back in my life 00:06:36.309 --> 00:06:41.437 cause I, I grew up with a lot of uh yelling and screaming in the house and 00:06:41.470 --> 00:06:47.467 all of that and I did not want that for my daughter. I just wanted so, so 00:06:47.500 --> 00:06:53.856 , so many. Uh, so much better of a life for her than I had, and if it 00:06:53.889 --> 00:06:59.616 meant not having a partner, which I began to think was maybe a, a, a flaw 00:06:59.649 --> 00:07:07.046 in me or some kind of failing in me that I just could not, uh, I mentally 00:07:07.079 --> 00:07:10.447 handle it or I, I don't know. I don't know. I, I never thought that at the 00:07:10.480 --> 00:07:14.926 time, but as I got older and, and uh Hannah would ask me about her dad, 00:07:14.959 --> 00:07:18.856 which didn't happen until she was in her teens, um, I thought, gosh, maybe 00:07:18.889 --> 00:07:22.205 I, maybe I failed, maybe I should have been married, maybe I should have 00:07:22.238 --> 00:07:28.596 had somebody here for her, you know, another, um, another, another parent 00:07:28.629 --> 00:07:33.265 and so then I started to feel, you know, a little guilty about it, but. 00:07:33.298 --> 00:07:38.877 But when I, I was so focused on, on raising her that I never really 00:07:38.910 --> 00:07:43.356 thought about it until like I was with my girlfriend or whatever and and 00:07:43.389 --> 00:07:47.476 then we get together, our kids were about the same age and I, you know, 00:07:47.509 --> 00:07:51.836 she had a husband and that was, you know, I don't know, it just seemed 00:07:51.869 --> 00:07:56.995 like a. I was looking for that perfect family life and I just, I, I would 00:07:57.028 --> 00:08:01.877 be really envious sometimes and then other times I just when I was around 00:08:01.910 --> 00:08:06.476 it and then when I wasn't, I was just so focused on, on, on taking care of 00:08:06.509 --> 00:08:13.515 her that I didn't, um, never really thought about uh having uh uh uh a 00:08:13.548 --> 00:08:19.995 partner but then, you know, I, I was in my 30s and um I I wanted to have 00:08:20.028 --> 00:08:25.166 another child and I. I had a boyfriend at the time and I, I don't know. I 00:08:25.199 --> 00:08:30.305 , I think it's got to be a flaw in me or something. It just, it just 00:08:30.338 --> 00:08:34.145 doesn't work out. I don't know if it's like I see that I've I've picked 00:08:34.178 --> 00:08:39.505 somebody that just isn't up to my caliber. I tend to pick guys who are 00:08:39.538 --> 00:08:43.346 maybe a little bit, um, they don't have as good of a job or I feel like I 00:08:43.379 --> 00:08:47.557 need to take care of them. And then once I'm uh realized oh I've made the 00:08:47.590 --> 00:08:52.037 same mistake again, I, you know, it's, it's time to move on. I got tired 00:08:52.070 --> 00:08:55.467 of, of going through that, so I finally decided I'm, I'm just done with 00:08:55.500 --> 00:08:59.196 the boyfriends. I'm done with the, with the, you know, and by the time I 00:08:59.229 --> 00:09:04.037 got to my late 30s, I figured I'm, I'm done. I'm gonna just have Hannah 00:09:04.070 --> 00:09:08.875 and concentrate on her and, and, and, and it was, it was, it was good but 00:09:08.908 --> 00:09:13.586 it's just my. Body going crazy again like wanting another child and once I 00:09:13.619 --> 00:09:18.746 got past that I was good. I was good. It's really been interesting through 00:09:18.779 --> 00:09:23.866 this process we've seen this a lot and heard a lot of women talk about 00:09:23.899 --> 00:09:29.015 this sense of what an idealized experience is and then this kind of guilt 00:09:29.048 --> 00:09:33.566 that comes along with not providing that. But oftentimes, you know, what 00:09:33.599 --> 00:09:38.775 they had provided is this incredible home for their child and being a 00:09:38.808 --> 00:09:42.885 wonderful role model and you know I mean it has such a sense of 00:09:42.918 --> 00:09:47.836 independence too I I think that that has to have come from you. She's her 00:09:47.869 --> 00:09:54.885 own person, 100%. 0, I know. And it it it broke my heart when she, I was 00:09:54.918 --> 00:09:59.037 proud of her, but broke my heart when she, I mean, I wanted her to, but it 00:09:59.070 --> 00:10:04.736 was that mixed feeling when she went away to college. And her, she 00:10:04.769 --> 00:10:09.135 separated herself from me at that point completely, and I, I cried about 00:10:09.168 --> 00:10:15.336 it a lot because she did not want me to come up. She, I understand it now 00:10:15.369 --> 00:10:18.856 and even now thinking about it makes me want to cry, but she was breaking 00:10:18.889 --> 00:10:22.336 away. She was like, I need to become my own person. I'm not, she would say 00:10:22.369 --> 00:10:25.936 , you know, the mean things that teenagers say, I'm not your little doll 00:10:25.969 --> 00:10:30.015 that you can just dress up and, and, and make like you make a, I'm not a 00:10:30.048 --> 00:10:34.557 carbon copy of you. I'm not a. And now I see it, but then I, I didn't, you 00:10:34.590 --> 00:10:41.476 know, and so we had a, uh, between the age of 13 and maybe um 18, it was a 00:10:41.509 --> 00:10:47.917 really tough time because she was asserting her independence and I, she 00:10:47.950 --> 00:10:52.316 was the most uh precious thing in the world to me and I just the thought 00:10:52.349 --> 00:10:58.116 of anything bad happening to her and, and. You know, I, it was so funny. I 00:10:58.149 --> 00:11:02.135 , uh, never had boyfriends in, in my teenage years, not until I graduated 00:11:02.168 --> 00:11:04.736 high school. She had a boyfriend in junior high. She had a boyfriend in 00:11:04.769 --> 00:11:09.657 high school that was all through high school and, um, I don't know, she's 00:11:09.690 --> 00:11:17.015 just, uh, uh, now it's kind of come back around to where she wants me to 00:11:17.048 --> 00:11:21.976 be there now, but now, but she moved back from flag and she moved in with 00:11:22.009 --> 00:11:27.856 me and after a year, she says, I, I need my own space. If that was me 00:11:27.889 --> 00:11:32.177 living with my that's why I left. I needed my own space. I could not even 00:11:32.210 --> 00:11:36.255 be in that, not that her environment was bad, my environment was bad, but 00:11:36.288 --> 00:11:40.537 um I, I understand it now and it's so much better that uh that um 00:11:40.570 --> 00:11:45.057 apartment she has down there on Grand. That's a great place. I said, it is 00:11:45.090 --> 00:11:50.856 so funny that you live between 15th Ave and 16th Ave. And when I bought my 00:11:50.889 --> 00:11:57.807 house, it was on 16th Ave and um Uh, McDowell near the Coliseum, and I 00:11:57.840 --> 00:12:02.246 love that neighborhood. I, I loved Phoenix. I lived in Phoenix five years 00:12:02.279 --> 00:12:06.446 and then I thought, oh, this isn't a good neighborhood to raise my child. 00:12:06.479 --> 00:12:11.635 I need to move back to the suburbs. Blah, I just, I just didn't know how 00:12:11.668 --> 00:12:16.467 much I didn't, didn't uh like it till later on when she went to college 00:12:16.500 --> 00:12:19.566 and I, I looked around and I went, you know, I, this is OK to raise a 00:12:19.599 --> 00:12:24.375 child, but this is not. Not for me. I'm glad I did it, but in high school 00:12:24.408 --> 00:12:28.456 she, she was even ready to move on. She wanted to be in a more vibrant, 00:12:28.489 --> 00:12:33.576 more, um, you know, like Phoenix is that type of community the suburbs 00:12:33.609 --> 00:12:36.606 were not for her and a lot of bad things happened to some of her friends 00:12:36.639 --> 00:12:40.856 and, and, and one thing that really caused a, a, a, uh, what do you call 00:12:40.889 --> 00:12:45.726 it a um. It was a really substantial event in her life and still causes 00:12:45.759 --> 00:12:50.275 her a little bit of pain was one of her best friends who was her boyfriend 00:12:50.308 --> 00:12:56.816 for a little bit dying and um uh some of her friends were into drugs, not 00:12:56.849 --> 00:13:01.287 all of them, some of them a boy she was with in kindergarten they grew up 00:13:01.320 --> 00:13:06.167 together. uh, he got into drugs and they have now since he is done with 00:13:06.200 --> 00:13:12.946 that. He he he he does um. Uh, uh, uh, he had his a band and now he does 00:13:12.979 --> 00:13:17.057 acoustic shows with another friend of hers from high school and they got 00:13:17.090 --> 00:13:21.866 back together, you know, met and they played at Grant Street. That's great. 00:13:21.899 --> 00:13:24.967 Yeah, 00:13:25.000 --> 00:13:28.106 circle seems to be a very happy, well adjusted person. good relationship 00:13:28.139 --> 00:13:30.706 with her mom. 00:13:30.739 --> 00:13:37.907 So when you were with her father and those urges of wanting to have a baby 00:13:37.940 --> 00:13:45.206 , which I'm fully aware of, um, did you at that point, were you not using 00:13:45.239 --> 00:13:48.596 protection or anything? You just thought, we'll just see what happens? 00:13:48.629 --> 00:13:53.917 That's what made me think I, I, I was looking for that to happen. I did 00:13:53.950 --> 00:13:58.836 not, and I would always use the excuse of I don't like taking uh telling 00:13:58.869 --> 00:14:04.316 myself this. I don't like taking the birth control and uh the pills 00:14:04.349 --> 00:14:07.635 because they always made me, I don't know, I'd switch on and off to 00:14:07.668 --> 00:14:12.946 different brands. They always made me feel like not good. So I didn't like 00:14:12.979 --> 00:14:16.586 him. I, I certainly didn't want anything inserted inside of me as far as 00:14:16.619 --> 00:14:20.667 diaphragm, any of those, any of those things. I, I, it was either gonna be 00:14:20.700 --> 00:14:27.596 birth control or uh Or condoms, but uh now at that time, no. So I, I'm 00:14:27.629 --> 00:14:31.417 pretty sure that's what I was looking for to happen. It's interesting, 00:14:31.450 --> 00:14:37.246 your subconscious seems to play a role, you know, and even postponing, you 00:14:37.279 --> 00:14:43.936 know, um. Alternatives, you know, to having the continuing with the 00:14:43.969 --> 00:14:47.096 pregnancy or not, you know, that maybe subconsciously you just really 00:14:47.129 --> 00:14:55.129 wanted to continue with that. Yeah, yeah, I was um um. I was uh uh afraid 00:14:55.330 --> 00:14:58.407 that um. 00:14:58.440 --> 00:15:03.125 That I actually wouldn't get pregnant. I wasn't afraid of becoming 00:15:03.158 --> 00:15:09.525 pregnant, so I, I just, uh, I was afraid that, you know, I don't know, I, 00:15:09.558 --> 00:15:15.125 your, your hormones and just I didn't realize what how much of a control 00:15:15.158 --> 00:15:22.167 it had over my body and my mind at that time. It just really, you know, 00:15:22.200 --> 00:15:26.885 like uh you think you're in love or you're, you're, you know, wanting a 00:15:26.918 --> 00:15:32.316 baby or you're. Uh, wanting a boyfriend or whatever, it's just so not, uh 00:15:32.349 --> 00:15:39.826 , your head is not in control of. Of everything and so it was more um just 00:15:39.859 --> 00:15:46.787 a drive for me to, you know, I must get this accomplished, you know, uh 00:15:46.820 --> 00:15:51.866 before I never had set a date like oh I have to be, you know, a mother by 00:15:51.899 --> 00:15:57.265 this date, but I'm, I'm glad that it didn't happen to me and I was, I told 00:15:57.298 --> 00:16:00.976 my dog this. I was promiscuous after high school. I never had a boyfriend 00:16:01.009 --> 00:16:06.826 and I had one after high school and I used to go out. Uh, party. I never 00:16:06.859 --> 00:16:13.025 really did drugs. I drank and I was very promiscuous, so I'm surprised 00:16:13.058 --> 00:16:17.706 that it didn't happen before then. I'm surprised I didn't wind up with a 00:16:17.739 --> 00:16:23.706 much worse, you know, I had a couple like the mild STDs which caused me to 00:16:23.739 --> 00:16:30.275 stop being promiscuous, but when that happened, but um, yeah, I um. I, uh 00:16:30.308 --> 00:16:35.417 , was just, uh, I heard all the talk in my teenage years and girls had 00:16:35.450 --> 00:16:38.895 boyfriends and all this talk and I never knew what was, you know, I always 00:16:38.928 --> 00:16:42.816 felt like the odd person out like I was never let in on this club and I'm 00:16:42.849 --> 00:16:46.976 glad I, and I've told Hannah this. I'm glad it didn't happen then. I'm 00:16:47.009 --> 00:16:51.616 glad it didn't happen in my mid-twenties because I was being selfish. I 00:16:51.649 --> 00:16:57.255 was, uh, being, uh, she said I was a bad girl. I was being a bad girl. I 00:16:57.288 --> 00:17:00.525 wasn't ready for that and I wouldn't have been a good parent. So by the 00:17:00.558 --> 00:17:06.686 time I got to my late 20s, I, I don't know, things had changed for me. I 00:17:06.719 --> 00:17:10.196 was, I, I quit all that pretty much when I was about her age, now when I'm 00:17:10.229 --> 00:17:16.006 24, 25. So in the years prior prior to having her, those 4 or 5 years, I 00:17:16.039 --> 00:17:23.967 was, um, um, I was more uh more grown up and more done with being really 00:17:24.000 --> 00:17:29.085 selfish. That's great. That's interesting. So then. Um, can you talk a 00:17:29.118 --> 00:17:32.656 little bit about your experience with pregnancy? 00:17:32.689 --> 00:17:40.377 Um, I thought before I went to the doctor that I might be, but I thought, 00:17:40.410 --> 00:17:44.857 no, I've never been up to this point. Why should it happen now? And then I 00:17:44.890 --> 00:17:48.575 remember I was out. I went to lunch with one of my friends and I went in 00:17:48.608 --> 00:17:52.575 the bathroom and I looked and I saw blood and I thought, uh, I'm starting 00:17:52.608 --> 00:17:56.936 my period and then there was no more after that and and then I started 00:17:56.969 --> 00:18:01.176 feeling a little, you know, I just knew something was. Off so I said I 00:18:01.209 --> 00:18:06.016 gotta go to the doctor because I, I'm pretty sure and then when he told me 00:18:06.049 --> 00:18:12.736 , I just, you know, I'm sure a lot of, I just wasn't excited so I um, I, 00:18:12.769 --> 00:18:18.295 um, you know, like I said, I kept going and going and until I was past the 00:18:18.328 --> 00:18:23.897 point of, of no return and then, um, people at work were really my 00:18:23.930 --> 00:18:27.377 girlfriend and I at work, we worked in the same office we were pregnant 00:18:27.410 --> 00:18:31.656 pretty much the same time and they were really. Really good about they 00:18:31.689 --> 00:18:38.897 gave us a, a, a baby shower and um I had a really the first start of it 00:18:38.930 --> 00:18:44.325 just like every I'm sure a lot of women was I was sick a lot staying and 00:18:44.358 --> 00:18:51.097 and just um uh nauseous a lot and uh you know, staying home from work a 00:18:51.130 --> 00:18:56.357 few times, not much, but I worked up until my 9th month. And um uh it was 00:18:56.390 --> 00:19:04.117 a really good uh pregnancy. I, but my ninth month, I was done. I was, I 00:19:04.150 --> 00:19:09.575 had swelled up my, I retained so much water. I, my average weight was 00:19:09.608 --> 00:19:16.075 between 1 back then, 1135, 145, so I was pretty thin. By the time I was in 00:19:16.108 --> 00:19:21.726 my 9th month, I was almost 200 pounds. Uh, my legs were, were, I didn't 00:19:21.759 --> 00:19:27.656 have ankles. My legs were huge and I. I waddled and I and it was hot. It 00:19:27.689 --> 00:19:34.535 was May going into June and I was, I was miserable, but that was the time 00:19:34.568 --> 00:19:39.377 I was, I, I don't know what I thought I was doing. I went in my 6th and 00:19:39.410 --> 00:19:43.736 7th month I decided I need to sell this house. I really don't want to be 00:19:43.769 --> 00:19:49.016 here with, I thought that even before then, but I really, I got a realtor. 00:19:49.049 --> 00:19:52.926 And then I started doing just little things thinking I was not pregnant, 00:19:52.959 --> 00:19:59.305 I mowed the yard. I started bleeding. I had to go to the emergency room 00:19:59.338 --> 00:20:04.137 and my girlfriend was wanting to You know, she was really angry at me. 00:20:04.170 --> 00:20:07.176 She's like, you're probably having a miscarriage, and I was just horrified. 00:20:07.209 --> 00:20:10.736 I'm like, what was I thinking trying to be out mowing the yard when I'm, 00:20:10.769 --> 00:20:14.335 I was probably like maybe 4 or 5 months pregnant. Like, wait a minute, I 00:20:14.368 --> 00:20:18.897 really start need to take this seriously now and stop, you know, messing 00:20:18.930 --> 00:20:23.936 around like this. And so I was fine. They sent me home, no more, you know 00:20:23.969 --> 00:20:28.377 , really strenuous activity. Although I do remember exercising in the 00:20:28.410 --> 00:20:32.357 early months. I was still exercising then. But I don't know how some women 00:20:32.390 --> 00:20:36.835 do it today when they're like huge and they're exercising. No, no, not, I 00:20:36.868 --> 00:20:40.496 couldn't have done that. But I have to tell you, I did one more stupid 00:20:40.529 --> 00:20:44.516 thing. Um, the house was on the market and it looked like it was gonna be 00:20:44.549 --> 00:20:52.026 sold and there was, um. Uh, I had a, it was a little 1920s bungalow. I 00:20:52.059 --> 00:20:55.387 love, I love and I miss that house to this day, and it had an arch over 00:20:55.420 --> 00:21:00.266 the, the driveway and there was like a little crack in the arch and I was 00:21:00.299 --> 00:21:03.867 like, you know, the house just doesn't look perfect and I didn't, you know 00:21:03.900 --> 00:21:06.867 , it didn't occur to me that I could go ask one of my neighbors or anybody 00:21:06.900 --> 00:21:11.916 for help. I got a ladder. I put it up there. I was like 8 months now and I 00:21:11.949 --> 00:21:15.305 spackled it and I was painting. And when I was done, I looked down and I 00:21:15.338 --> 00:21:21.127 went. What am I doing up here on this ladder? Am I crazy? So I got back 00:21:21.160 --> 00:21:25.647 down and I, and I, uh, but then I, I had friends help me move. I was 00:21:25.680 --> 00:21:29.406 lifting stuff to move. I, I sold the house and I moved into an apartment. 00:21:29.439 --> 00:21:34.266 I was just doing really Uh, although exercise is strenuous, I don't know 00:21:34.299 --> 00:21:38.305 how some women do that, but I was moving and lifting things and just 00:21:38.338 --> 00:21:42.266 pretty much right up until, you know, the end, and then the doctor gives 00:21:42.299 --> 00:21:48.367 you a, uh, you know, a, a date, and that date came and went, so. I can 00:21:48.400 --> 00:21:52.956 tell you about what happened after that. They called me in. They said 00:21:52.989 --> 00:21:59.196 we're gonna have um uh the what do they call it to make you go into labor 00:21:59.229 --> 00:22:04.166 because nothing was happening. It was a week and a half had gone by, uh, 00:22:04.199 --> 00:22:07.607 since the predicted date, which was the end of May, and they gave me, um, 00:22:07.640 --> 00:22:13.055 the Pitocin. And I laid there for 3, I mean, I went home every day. I laid 00:22:13.088 --> 00:22:16.575 there for a few hours every day, listening to women all around me give 00:22:16.608 --> 00:22:21.857 birth, going, oh, maybe tomorrow, maybe tomorrow, and I could just, you 00:22:21.890 --> 00:22:26.055 know, I could hear all the sounds you make of giving birth, you know, the 00:22:26.088 --> 00:22:31.055 natural way I'd been to birth classes with my girlfriend. I didn't have, 00:22:31.088 --> 00:22:36.226 you know, probably the only one in there without a man, and, um, uh. But 00:22:36.259 --> 00:22:39.387 I'm telling you, it just didn't, it didn't matter to me still, it still 00:22:39.420 --> 00:22:44.585 didn't matter. And um so I went back the next day, put the needle in my 00:22:44.618 --> 00:22:49.946 arm again, listen to the women all around me giving birth and then, you 00:22:49.979 --> 00:22:54.906 know, then like crying like come on I just want this to happen because I 00:22:54.939 --> 00:22:57.627 went through the classes. I'm like, OK, I'm gonna do this and do this and 00:22:57.660 --> 00:23:02.217 do this just like they said. They said come back tomorrow. Nothing's 00:23:02.250 --> 00:23:06.575 happened. I had no contractions. I had nothing, and I was as big as a 00:23:06.608 --> 00:23:13.006 house, miserable, mostly because miserable because I was so swollen, and I 00:23:13.039 --> 00:23:17.256 went, came back the next day, needle in the arm, and finally got to be 00:23:17.289 --> 00:23:21.256 around 11 o'clock and I'd been there 2 hours, 3 hours already, and they 00:23:21.289 --> 00:23:24.696 said, you know, this isn't happening we're gonna, we're gonna go to 00:23:24.729 --> 00:23:31.585 C-section and I was like. Good, good, because by then I was just so tired 00:23:31.618 --> 00:23:38.585 and emotionally tired of hearing all the women giving birth but me. So 00:23:38.618 --> 00:23:43.107 they, you know, and I, I had no idea what a C-section was because, I mean 00:23:43.140 --> 00:23:48.026 , I, I kind of knew, but I didn't know what exactly was involved because I 00:23:48.059 --> 00:23:51.226 wasn't going to have that. I was going to have natural childbirth. So you 00:23:51.259 --> 00:23:55.117 know, they, you know, and it just happened, boom, boom, boom. And um 00:23:55.150 --> 00:23:59.795 actually um that day her dad was there, her dad and uh my girlfriend were 00:23:59.828 --> 00:24:06.276 were there and um. They put the needle in my uh needle in and I mean it 00:24:06.309 --> 00:24:10.097 happened so fast. Noon they said around 12 they said we're going to 00:24:10.130 --> 00:24:15.045 C-section and she was born at 125, so it was fast. I mean wheel me in. I 00:24:15.078 --> 00:24:19.085 mean everything went numb, wheel me in and they let they let her dad stay 00:24:19.118 --> 00:24:26.706 in there and um. I just remember, uh, smelling burning flesh and going, 00:24:26.739 --> 00:24:29.967 I'm gonna throw up, give me something. And I kept saying, I'm gonna throw 00:24:30.000 --> 00:24:33.065 up, I'm gonna throw up. And they said, give her more, whatever it was, 00:24:33.098 --> 00:24:37.492 anti-nausea medication cause I did not want to barf on my. Self or because 00:24:37.525 --> 00:24:39.651 that's why I didn't know they would give you anything. I thought I was 00:24:39.684 --> 00:24:42.690 just going to barf on myself and I was like, I'm gonna throw up. I'm gonna 00:24:42.723 --> 00:24:46.690 throw up. I kept saying that and finally he, you know, they gave me 00:24:46.723 --> 00:24:50.401 something and I felt a little bit better and it seemed just that smell 00:24:50.434 --> 00:24:54.571 because he used a laser and they, they, they don't, they didn't go up and 00:24:54.604 --> 00:24:58.351 down like most. I did the bikini one where they give you and, and, but the 00:24:58.384 --> 00:25:02.151 , the laser was the, the, I thought they were gonna cut me. He used a 00:25:02.184 --> 00:25:07.055 laser and that was the, the burning. Flesh smell that was making me sick. 00:25:07.088 --> 00:25:12.986 And um it just seemed to like go really fast and pretty soon they were, 00:25:13.019 --> 00:25:16.867 they, they, you know, they reached up and they, they like pushed and, and 00:25:16.900 --> 00:25:21.426 um her, her, I remember her head popped out or so they, they say they got 00:25:21.459 --> 00:25:26.315 , you know, I couldn't see and um she just, just kind of went like kind of 00:25:26.348 --> 00:25:32.266 like a cry like. You know, like, why, why are you doing this? Like, uh, 00:25:32.299 --> 00:25:37.305 like put me back, like, uh, it was like kind of a e cry and then, you know 00:25:37.338 --> 00:25:40.467 , then she came out and then she really started crying and then, you know 00:25:40.500 --> 00:25:45.666 , it was um uh it was just me and another lady in the, the hospital and it 00:25:45.699 --> 00:25:51.545 was somebody that I had gone through the birth class with and um The first 00:25:51.578 --> 00:25:56.627 night I must have hit the button for meds a million times. I was in such 00:25:56.660 --> 00:25:59.867 pain and they didn't bring her to me until the next day and I didn't want 00:25:59.900 --> 00:26:03.867 her to take her away. I'm in pain, take her away, but they got you up 00:26:03.900 --> 00:26:08.617 right away. They made me take a shower, they made me walk, which I could 00:26:08.650 --> 00:26:13.305 barely do, and um they brought her to me to to start nursing, but I'm 00:26:13.338 --> 00:26:16.825 telling you the first couple of days I didn't want her. And then because I 00:26:16.858 --> 00:26:21.776 was just so like out of it. And then by the end of the 2nd day I heard her 00:26:21.809 --> 00:26:26.535 crying and the, the nurses, she, she was in the, the little container, um 00:26:26.568 --> 00:26:32.496 , and I, at the nurses's station or wherever they had her and um so I went 00:26:32.529 --> 00:26:35.456 to find her because, you know, it was just the crying was like, oh my God 00:26:35.489 --> 00:26:39.637 , that's my baby. I was like kind of coming out of it and so I kind of 00:26:39.670 --> 00:26:42.456 walked down till I found somebody. I said, could you, could you bring her 00:26:42.489 --> 00:26:47.717 in now? And I had a really hard time nursing and a hard time. You know, um 00:26:47.750 --> 00:26:51.506 , I don't know, I just, I kind of knew what to do automatically, but then 00:26:51.539 --> 00:26:56.637 again, I was like just having the, the C-section. I didn't realize what 00:26:56.670 --> 00:27:02.916 major surgery that was. I didn't know. I just thought, oh, just simple, 00:27:02.949 --> 00:27:08.795 and I was in a lot of pain, but um by the 3rd day I was good and. And then 00:27:08.828 --> 00:27:11.825 they actually let me stay a 4th. They wanted to kick me out after the 3rd 00:27:11.858 --> 00:27:16.097 , but the doctor said I could stay a 4th. By the 4th day I was, I was 00:27:16.130 --> 00:27:20.127 doing, I was doing pretty good. They, it was really nice. They, um, you 00:27:20.160 --> 00:27:23.666 know, uh, um. 00:27:23.699 --> 00:27:28.426 Almost said the husband, my boyfriend came to see me and we had, they 00:27:28.459 --> 00:27:31.906 brought us a nice dinner and we had champagne and you know it was really 00:27:31.939 --> 00:27:35.176 nice. It was a really, it was a really nice experience. I mean, I didn't, 00:27:35.209 --> 00:27:39.127 I didn't like ask for any upgraded services or anything. It was just 00:27:39.160 --> 00:27:42.627 something that they did back then, you know, they asked if you wanted. I'm 00:27:42.660 --> 00:27:47.325 like, sure, yeah, that sounds good, make me feel better and. And when I 00:27:47.358 --> 00:27:52.666 left, uh, the hospital, that I had to sit in a wheelchair. I did not want 00:27:52.699 --> 00:27:56.166 to leave with her. I didn't want to take her out into that world. I did 00:27:56.199 --> 00:27:59.526 not. I was like, oh no, she's so clean and beautiful. I do not want to 00:27:59.559 --> 00:28:02.766 leave this hospital. I want to just raise her hair, you know, it's just 00:28:02.799 --> 00:28:06.516 like crazy thoughts going through your head and I just, I just thought 00:28:06.549 --> 00:28:10.756 that the world outside was just so dirty and nasty and, and I didn't want 00:28:10.789 --> 00:28:15.637 her to, to, to touch her, you know, but. Yeah, it was really quick for 00:28:15.670 --> 00:28:21.825 having to wait those those days and expecting that that would happen and 00:28:21.858 --> 00:28:27.877 just it was a whole different, whole different thing, but um uh it was 00:28:27.910 --> 00:28:32.795 kind of a blur actually it just went so fast. Do you remember the um 00:28:32.828 --> 00:28:40.377 hospital room or yeah yeah yeah it was it was nice because it was um. It 00:28:40.410 --> 00:28:44.696 was not, it was, I was by myself and it was, there were not a lot of 00:28:44.729 --> 00:28:48.815 people there that day. He and the other little boy were the only two born 00:28:48.848 --> 00:28:56.848 within that 3 day uh span that I recall that were there, yeah. Oh, it was 00:28:59.949 --> 00:29:04.436 I was in an operating room. So was your boyfriend at the time like 00:29:04.469 --> 00:29:11.436 videotaping or did you? No, I didn't get to see anything, and he took my 00:29:11.469 --> 00:29:15.835 only one person could be in there, so he took the pictures, which are OK. 00:29:15.868 --> 00:29:19.035 I have pictures of them holding her up with the umbilical cord still 00:29:19.068 --> 00:29:24.426 attached and her on the warming table. And but nothing, you know, her 00:29:24.459 --> 00:29:29.867 emerging any anything like that. He, we didn't have a video camera and um 00:29:29.900 --> 00:29:33.815 and another thing I never got was the my ultrasounds. I didn't know you 00:29:33.848 --> 00:29:37.545 could, and they never offered back then. They never offered them. You had 00:29:37.578 --> 00:29:41.585 to ask and it didn't occur to me until after she was born. They said, did 00:29:41.618 --> 00:29:45.305 you get the ultrasounds? Some of my friends said, no, we'll go back and 00:29:45.338 --> 00:29:48.825 they couldn't find them or what so I never got those. But yeah, they, you 00:29:48.858 --> 00:29:52.906 had to ask back then. There was a. Not anything like today where it's like 00:29:52.939 --> 00:29:57.347 3D and they they offer them to or they automatically give them to you but 00:29:57.380 --> 00:30:02.467 yeah um yeah it was it was an operating room and uh there were two 00:30:02.500 --> 00:30:06.246 obstetricians that he had somebody else working with him and I think two 00:30:06.279 --> 00:30:13.585 nurses and then the anesthesiologist and, and uh my boyfriend. So yeah, 00:30:13.618 --> 00:30:17.867 and my family came down later but they're they're, they're strange. It 00:30:17.900 --> 00:30:23.065 wasn't like a. You know, like, oh, she had a baby. OK, let's go home. You 00:30:23.098 --> 00:30:29.387 know, it wasn't like a big, big deal for them. Were they really involved 00:30:29.420 --> 00:30:35.785 afterward at all? Yes, actually, uh, yes, my parents, uh, surprisingly 00:30:35.818 --> 00:30:39.746 were. They said, you know, what do you want to do when you go back to work 00:30:39.779 --> 00:30:44.486 ? And I said, I'm just going to hire somebody to come in and And watch her 00:30:44.519 --> 00:30:49.016 and um they I was living still in Phoenix but I had sold my house and I I 00:30:49.049 --> 00:30:52.295 wasn't gonna buy another uh I just didn't want to do that at the time and 00:30:52.328 --> 00:30:57.016 I uh was living in an apartment and uh they said well we're gonna move to 00:30:57.049 --> 00:31:00.857 Phoenix to the same apartments because they were retired and they were 00:31:00.890 --> 00:31:06.295 living in uh actually had just sold their house and we're kind of nomads 00:31:06.328 --> 00:31:09.456 or whatever gypsies and living in an apartment. They said we'll move to 00:31:09.489 --> 00:31:15.107 Phoenix and we'll. Um, take care of her for you. So I was working nights. 00:31:15.140 --> 00:31:19.196 I was working 11 o'clock at night to 8 in the morning, and they would only 00:31:19.229 --> 00:31:23.196 watch her. I would come home and I would, uh, they would watch her from 00:31:23.229 --> 00:31:26.996 when I got home till about 11 o'clock or noon, and then they would bring 00:31:27.029 --> 00:31:31.085 her back to me. So I was only getting like 4 or 5 hours of sleep. I was so 00:31:31.118 --> 00:31:39.118 tired. So tired and uh but uh they, they really helped me save, save money 00:31:39.170 --> 00:31:46.496 and I felt that they were she was um safe with with them even though I 00:31:46.529 --> 00:31:50.776 don't think they did so lot taking care of me, but they, they, I just felt 00:31:50.809 --> 00:31:56.217 she was safer with, with them. So I mean they took care of me OK. It was 00:31:56.250 --> 00:32:02.887 the just the atmosphere, the, the. It was a long time ago and they people 00:32:02.920 --> 00:32:06.877 treated or raised kids differently then it wasn't, it was a lot different. 00:32:06.910 --> 00:32:13.785 So uh um I was um more attentive to her and what I tell people when I 00:32:13.818 --> 00:32:17.597 tell um or tell Hannah anyway and I've told a couple of my girlfriends 00:32:17.630 --> 00:32:25.137 this that is I. I wanted to, I wanted to raise her like, um, like I wanted 00:32:25.170 --> 00:32:32.166 to be raised, you know, so I guess I I use that as a Uh, what do you want 00:32:32.199 --> 00:32:37.857 to say? I, I use that as a kind of a guideline to taking care of her, but 00:32:37.890 --> 00:32:44.986 , um, And I don't know, I, I had, I had fun doing, uh, it's not 00:32:45.019 --> 00:32:50.585 necessarily things that um. Uh, you know, things that were around when I 00:32:50.618 --> 00:32:55.956 was a child, but like I enrolled her in just uh like Jimboree or, you know 00:32:55.989 --> 00:32:59.706 , things like that. And it's so funny because even then she had a 00:32:59.739 --> 00:33:05.236 personality where she would join in with the other kids. She would go like 00:33:05.269 --> 00:33:09.676 uh they were doing a song in a circle and I could never get her to join in. 00:33:09.709 --> 00:33:15.835 She always wanted to be off on her own. She was independent even then, so 00:33:15.868 --> 00:33:23.446 yeah. I am, I, uh, they helped me out with her quite a bit, quite a bit. 00:33:23.479 --> 00:33:28.766 So uh that was their gift to me. I mean, um, I never had a good 00:33:28.799 --> 00:33:33.766 relationship. It was just a very strained relationship because I didn't 00:33:33.799 --> 00:33:38.726 want to be a part of the the family. I wanted to move as soon as I pretty 00:33:38.759 --> 00:33:42.776 much as soon as I graduated from high school. I wanted to get. Away 00:33:42.809 --> 00:33:47.726 because I wanted some peace and quiet and to not have because I, I knew 00:33:47.759 --> 00:33:53.696 all of that was wrong like, you know, shaming kids or uh hitting kids or I 00:33:53.729 --> 00:33:56.377 knew all that was wrong even when I was a little kid, I knew that was 00:33:56.410 --> 00:34:02.176 wrong. So I wanted to get away from that and I never did that with, with 00:34:02.209 --> 00:34:06.746 Hannah. She is only one time in the whole time she was growing up, we were 00:34:06.779 --> 00:34:13.584 in Toys R Us and she was tired and She didn't, she, she, it was back in 00:34:13.617 --> 00:34:16.226 those days you could play on the equipment they had set up and she was 00:34:16.259 --> 00:34:19.546 having a blast in one of the little houses. It's time to go. We gotta go 00:34:19.579 --> 00:34:22.985 home now. No, I don't want to go and I put her in the cart and it's the 00:34:23.018 --> 00:34:26.546 only time I've seen her throw a fit. She's like shaking the car and I 00:34:26.579 --> 00:34:29.905 don't wanna go. I don't wanna go. And I leaned really close to her. I said 00:34:29.938 --> 00:34:33.985 , stop. I leaned really close to her. I said, if you don't stop this now, 00:34:34.018 --> 00:34:39.646 you're not getting anything for your birthday. And she was really, she was 00:34:39.679 --> 00:34:45.287 like looking at me like, what? Like, did you, did my mom just say that to 00:34:45.320 --> 00:34:49.885 me? She was only like maybe 54 or 5. I said stop it. you know, I did it 00:34:49.918 --> 00:34:53.445 through clenched teeth like stop it now, you know, because people were 00:34:53.478 --> 00:34:58.856 looking and I didn't want that. But I never hit her but I was really mean 00:34:58.889 --> 00:35:05.675 when I hissed that in her in her ear. But um no, it was a She was, she was 00:35:05.708 --> 00:35:11.977 a blast to raise. I had so much fun, so much fun. We, she was like a 00:35:12.010 --> 00:35:16.655 little adult and she was, I would talk to her like an adult and we just 00:35:16.688 --> 00:35:23.017 had the best time. But yeah, I, uh, all those pictures I look at and I 00:35:23.050 --> 00:35:27.497 look at her now, I'm like, stop growing up, you know, I'm proud of her at 00:35:27.530 --> 00:35:33.307 the same time, but I miss those days. It was good times. That's that's 00:35:33.340 --> 00:35:37.796 really wonderful. I think, um, gosh, I would just love it if I only had to 00:35:37.829 --> 00:35:41.307 hear something like that. 00:35:41.340 --> 00:35:46.345 How many, how many children do you have? Oh, OK. Oh, OK, because I was 00:35:46.378 --> 00:35:50.186 gonna say if I'd had that second one, it might have been a different story. 00:35:50.219 --> 00:35:54.796 I don't think I had the patience. I really don't think so, um, or else he 00:35:54.829 --> 00:36:00.497 just knows that we're always bluffing, but um. So no, it's great. I think 00:36:00.530 --> 00:36:05.276 that's a really remarkable story and you're a good talker, which is good. 00:36:05.309 --> 00:36:10.936 Oh, I don't mean to be, I hope I'm not going off the subject. OK. So we're 00:36:10.969 --> 00:36:16.345 asking, we're categorizing these stories into themes and asking women to 00:36:16.378 --> 00:36:22.296 come up with maybe a word that encompasses their experience. The the birth 00:36:22.329 --> 00:36:29.936 or just having her. Oh my gosh. It's a challenge. Um, oh God, this, this 00:36:29.969 --> 00:36:36.336 word is used a lot. But I'm ah life changing. 00:36:36.369 --> 00:36:42.706 Just Life changing. I, there's lots of other words. I, I, I don't want to 00:36:42.739 --> 00:36:47.467 use. I'm gonna use life changing because all the other words are overused 00:36:47.500 --> 00:36:54.717 . I, I. You know, uh, it was amazing before amazing was uh really used a 00:36:54.750 --> 00:37:02.566 word, but it was for me, um, life changing cause I. It, um, I really liked 00:37:02.599 --> 00:37:10.599 being a child because just of the the new experiences, but I, you know, I 00:37:10.800 --> 00:37:16.206 , I, it's different when you get to experience it through your child's 00:37:16.239 --> 00:37:23.986 eyes. So Oh God, it was, it was just her fascination with we we were 00:37:24.019 --> 00:37:28.537 members of the, the zoo. We'd go to the zoo all the time. Just her 00:37:28.570 --> 00:37:32.945 fascination with the animals or seeing or be when she was younger, being 00:37:32.978 --> 00:37:39.526 able to point things out and being like Like you're amazing mom. Wow. It 00:37:39.559 --> 00:37:43.845 sure beats that later on in the teen years. God, you're so stupid. Don't 00:37:43.878 --> 00:37:48.365 you know anything? Don't you know how to use a computer? Uh, no, and I 00:37:48.398 --> 00:37:52.425 still have trouble. Um, or, you know, the games were coming out and her 00:37:52.458 --> 00:37:56.236 and I would try to get you, just forget it. I'm just gonna do it. You 00:37:56.269 --> 00:37:58.477 don't know how to do it. I'm like, you're right, I don't. I need you to 00:37:58.510 --> 00:38:01.916 teach me. I don't have time for that. I don't have time. Why can't you 00:38:01.949 --> 00:38:06.675 play? Cause I can't, Hannah. So for a while, it was hard to go from being 00:38:06.708 --> 00:38:11.195 the hero to like, oh God, you're so dumb, don't you know anything? I'm 00:38:11.228 --> 00:38:15.615 glad that's over with. That was hard. That was really hard. I can only 00:38:15.648 --> 00:38:21.635 imagine. Oh gosh, it was hard being the, the, you know, somebody's got to 00:38:21.668 --> 00:38:26.577 be. I mean, if like maybe if there's both parents, there's like one's that 00:38:26.610 --> 00:38:32.876 one has to be good cop one's bad cop. I had to be both so but um it didn't 00:38:32.909 --> 00:38:38.876 really bother me until I did off and on when I would think of going to, 00:38:38.909 --> 00:38:43.037 you know, I went to lawyers like 2 or 3 different times and paid them to 00:38:43.070 --> 00:38:46.195 sit there and be told that, you know, if you get money from him he's going 00:38:46.228 --> 00:38:53.836 to have to see her and I said um I said no, forget it, unless you're gonna 00:38:53.869 --> 00:38:59.595 guarantee me thousands a month, which I know that will never happen, no, 00:38:59.628 --> 00:39:04.276 and I get up and leave and then. I'd feel bad that it didn't work out or 00:39:04.309 --> 00:39:09.876 she didn't have another parent, but, um, mostly, uh, it, it kind of hit me 00:39:09.909 --> 00:39:15.115 when she went to NAU and one of her professors kind of became like a for 00:39:15.148 --> 00:39:20.796 to her uh uh uh like a surrogate father figure. So and then she would 00:39:20.829 --> 00:39:24.276 started talking to me about her dad and I said, you know, he probably 00:39:24.309 --> 00:39:27.517 still lives in Phoenix, you can look him up if you want. I said, it's up 00:39:27.550 --> 00:39:32.296 to you. I said, personally, you're not a good person. But I have a 00:39:32.329 --> 00:39:36.986 different relationship with him than he's your biological father. He never 00:39:37.019 --> 00:39:40.816 was around, so he's not really, you know, what I, I, I would never really 00:39:40.849 --> 00:39:44.017 bad mouth him. I mean like really bad, but I would say, you know, he 00:39:44.050 --> 00:39:48.057 wasn't around. Uh, and I, and personally, I think he's a horrible person. 00:39:48.090 --> 00:39:51.577 Uh, what I found out after living with him for a while, not a good person 00:39:51.610 --> 00:39:57.586 , uh, but, um. It's so funny, the videos that I have from back then or him 00:39:57.619 --> 00:40:03.155 playing with her, you know, she would ask him always to To, uh, like he 00:40:03.188 --> 00:40:06.276 would pick her up and flip her around, you know, she was about a year old 00:40:06.309 --> 00:40:11.756 before we split up and so like it on the surface it looks like a good 00:40:11.789 --> 00:40:16.425 thing, but it was, it was not a good person. He was not a good person. And 00:40:16.458 --> 00:40:21.425 I just have a feeling that his negativity and uh. Just some of the things 00:40:21.458 --> 00:40:25.506 that I found, he told me about himself, like he had like it seemed like he 00:40:25.539 --> 00:40:31.227 had some, uh, just some serious mental problems just from him, you know, 00:40:31.260 --> 00:40:36.307 growing up the way he did and uh more so than I ever felt I had. So anyway 00:40:36.340 --> 00:40:41.986 , she chose not to look him up, but, um, you know, I said, you know, he, 00:40:42.019 --> 00:40:45.905 once in a while we're driving down, he used to live over by Cano Park and 00:40:45.938 --> 00:40:48.385 we, we'll be driving that way and I said, you know, I used to live over 00:40:48.418 --> 00:40:52.736 here if you wanna go. She said, Nah. No, that's OK. I'm good. I'm good. I 00:40:52.769 --> 00:40:58.497 just think after all now 25 or 24 years, it would be like, what's the 00:40:58.530 --> 00:41:02.977 point? I mean, I don't know. He has never reached out to try and contact 00:41:03.010 --> 00:41:08.445 her ever, offered anything ever. So he he was just praying that I would go 00:41:08.478 --> 00:41:13.046 away and not, he, he told me one of the things that I thought was, you 00:41:13.079 --> 00:41:17.405 know, part of the, the bigger picture of him being just an overall bad 00:41:17.438 --> 00:41:20.896 person was, uh, if you ever try to get a penny out of me, I'll make your 00:41:20.929 --> 00:41:28.467 life miserable. So I, I will never ever ever cross your path again, and I 00:41:28.500 --> 00:41:31.506 hope to God you don't cross, and he didn't, he was, I never heard from him 00:41:31.539 --> 00:41:37.945 again. That always amazes me. Yeah, his name so she can. Oh yeah, yeah. In 00:41:37.978 --> 00:41:42.425 fact, her name was his last name. I had it changed when she was about, 00:41:42.458 --> 00:41:45.186 well, after we split up, she was almost 2. I went to court and had it 00:41:45.219 --> 00:41:49.345 changed to mine. I figured, why not, why not? It bothered me that we 00:41:49.378 --> 00:41:53.146 wouldn't have the same. Name, you know what I mean? If I was gonna raise 00:41:53.179 --> 00:41:57.506 her, it wasn't like an eagle thing or anything like that. It was just, 00:41:57.539 --> 00:42:01.827 it's just better if we have the same last name, just better, you know. So 00:42:01.860 --> 00:42:06.146 yeah, I even changed her middle name too because her middle name was uh 00:42:06.179 --> 00:42:11.477 his, his aunt's middle name, I mean, his aunt's first name and I just. 00:42:11.510 --> 00:42:15.256 Hannah was my, my choice, and the middle name was his. Of course, she had 00:42:15.289 --> 00:42:18.497 his last name because he signed the birth certificate. I just, I'm gonna 00:42:18.530 --> 00:42:22.767 change anything related to him. So yeah, in fact, I, I heard from his 00:42:22.800 --> 00:42:26.925 mother, uh, quite a bit because I had met her when Hannah was little and 00:42:26.958 --> 00:42:30.577 she lived out of state. She kept trying to contact me and I wouldn't 00:42:30.610 --> 00:42:33.175 contact her back after we split up because I didn't want him to know 00:42:33.208 --> 00:42:37.236 anything about. I felt like he didn't deserve. To know anything about 00:42:37.269 --> 00:42:41.756 about her and you know uh when I was talking to somebody one day about you 00:42:41.789 --> 00:42:46.595 know how I kind of felt bad and about him not being in her life or 00:42:46.628 --> 00:42:52.477 whatever and and something to that effect and they said, you know, uh, 00:42:52.510 --> 00:42:57.717 he's the one who missed out. He missed everything. Everything and him 00:42:57.750 --> 00:43:01.396 trying to say that it's not his child. Oh my God. She looked so much like 00:43:01.429 --> 00:43:07.767 him when she was born. Well, uh, her bone structure. The cheeks and her 00:43:07.800 --> 00:43:14.577 ears stick out like his ears, and she has um the spacing of her eyes. His 00:43:14.610 --> 00:43:19.595 were wide, mine are more closer together and uh yeah, did look a lot when 00:43:19.628 --> 00:43:24.217 she was first born, I have pictures of myself when I was first born we 00:43:24.250 --> 00:43:27.256 look exactly alike, but when she got a little bit older, she looked, oh my 00:43:27.289 --> 00:43:32.006 God, she looks so much like him and. Now it doesn't seem to be so much the 00:43:32.039 --> 00:43:37.336 case, but um, no, she has no desire to contact. Oh that's me. It's OK. 00:43:37.369 --> 00:43:40.727 Sorry, sorry, 00:43:40.760 --> 00:43:45.307 sorry. No, that's interesting to say the least, my goodness. 00:43:45.340 --> 00:43:49.865 Well, is there anything that you'd feel like we've missed? No, I think 00:43:49.898 --> 00:43:55.467 I've told you. Yeah, yeah, and I didn't, I thought it would be kind of 00:43:55.500 --> 00:44:02.026 hard to get started, but you the questions and we'll get, it'll be it'll 00:44:02.059 --> 00:44:07.409 come to a really good story, I think. Oh, go ahead and hit stop.