OK.
This is Geneva Gill reviewing Maria H on 4 30 2015 for the undocumented
Voices Oral History project.
All right, this is a multi state project and the risk will vary depending
on the interview location. We have worked to minimize these risks by
attributing pseudonyms to all interviews collected. We will not collect
formal identified information such as full names, addresses, et cetera.
However, all interviews will be archived in their true original form, be
advised that any identified information given through the interview will
be available online publicly.
B Yeah. OK. So how did you get involved in the movement? And why? Um I
mean, I grew up with a lot of my cousins were actually undocumented. Um
And when prop 300 passed, I personally saw how a lot of my older cousins
who physically wanted to go to college and he ended up not being able to
do anything or go to college because of the high cost that were
incorporated with like these tuition hikes. Um So I personally saw how
like his dreams were crushed and it's just been something that's affected
my family personally. Um And that's why I decided to get involved. Um So
what groups were you involved with? Um, throughout high school, I wasn't
necessarily as involved as I would want to be, but it wasn't until I got
into a su and I started working on different political campaigns to try
and change the way and the direction that things were going for dreamers
and just the immigration community as a whole in Arizona. So it wasn't
until around 2011 that I didn't get involved like registering voters and
turning people out to vote. Because for me, that's one of the ways that
we'll be able to change things for this community. All right. And then
like, how did you participate? I know you said you did voter registration
but like with what organizations so like, were there certain campaign you
worked on? Yes. One of the specific campaigns that I worked on in 2012 was
uh you made known, it was called the Alos Arpaio campaign specifically,
you know, tailored to try and get this person out of office. Um Sheriff
Joe trying to get him not to be re-elected. Um And we registered nearly
35,000 people to vote. Majority of them were Latino um in the hopes of,
you know, like I said, getting this guy out of office who, you know, in
this community was just creating a lot of havoc. Um So that's specifically
one of the campaigns that I worked on and recently what I've been doing
and working on with an organization called Case is we have been trying to
get people's renewing their DACA and also giving information about DAPA as
well. Um, and getting people and students who are eligible to apply for
that or, you know, reapply as well. Ok. Um, and then have you participated
in any sit ins or other events? Apart from the ones listed, I've never
done a sit in personally. Um, I just, mainly, I've lobbied a couple of
times and I've also uh just done like marches.
Ok? And then I know you mentioned that your cousins um props 300 affected
your cousins. Like how,
how have they, how has that influenced you when it comes to the movement?
Um I guess it just made me more aware and feel I felt blessed to not have
to really go through what they've gone through. Um But more than anything
, it's made me just more of, I guess, aware about what's going on because
knowing, knowing that that could have been me um as well. So it just kind
of makes me, I guess, more aware and passionate to kind of do the work
that a lot of the times they didn't have the chance to. So it's kind of
just made me more aware. You said that it could have been you. So what,
what do you mean by that? Well, because my parents themselves were
undocumented for over 24 years. Um And if they hadn't had made the
decision to, you know, immigrate to the United States at the time that
they did. You know, I could have been born, you know, in Mexico as well
and gone through what my cousins are going through because I know for
example, one of them came here when he was two. So he doesn't, he doesn't
know Mexico even though he's over there now. But like he doesn't know, you
know, he's not from there. So like I said, that could have been me. That
could have been me too. So just because like my parents decided to, you
know, come here a little earlier, but that's definitely a reality I've had
all my life is that could have been me. So, you know, I wanna try and make
a difference whenever I can and then um within the movement, do you feel
like it's fragmented? What do they mean by fragmented? Like, do you feel
like it's divided between like states or certain, like, you know, there's
different movements, like, you know, there's a quit movement, there's
undocumented ways. Do you feel like it's just fragmented, like movement
itself? Like the dream, I feel like in, in earlier, like, it sort of was
um you know, there was different types of coalitions coming together all
trying to in a sense, accomplish the same thing. Um But I feel like as
time has gone on and with specifically with D AC A, I feel like a lot of
these organizations have more or so are starting to work more with each
other. So I feel like it's not as fragmented um as it used to be because
now, like with, like I said, with DACA, I feel like a lot of organizations
are trying to, you know, give students or people the opportunity to apply
for that. So I feel like DACA has really brought these people and these
movements together. And then with that, I know you said that you work with
Case, you've recently been working with Case for D A and D A, like what
role do you play within that? Um I am one of the people that helps give, I
basically help do surveys and see if people are eligible for DACA DAPA to
, you know, mainly in the work in the workplaces like hotels um like in my
workplace um help interview some of my coworkers. Um and through that, uh
see if they could potentially, you know, qualify for that. So mainly like
my workplace in the hotel industry. OK. And then how do you feel that DACA
has brought the movement together? Because that's what you said that you
said that you felt was five months earlier. But with the emergence of DACA
and DAPA, it's brought them more together because you think it's brought
them together. I think one of the ways it's brought them together, it's
given people kind of a goal and something to work with because before I
feel like everyone wanted to pass well, you know, they had their own
version of the dream act and stuff like that. But I feel like with D ac A
being something that people can actually apply for, um I feel like it's
kind of like, I, I just brought people together in a way of giving them
something to do and something more concrete to actually accomplish and
work towards versus, you know, other things um associated with like
dreamers. So you feel like it gave them like a set goal, like uh actual
visual of what they, they need to accomplish. OK. Um And then where do you
place yourself in the movement? I know you said, like you're involved with
certain organizations but where do you place yourself in the movement?
Mm mm I think I am sort of, well, I place myself as I guess an ally
because I myself am not undocumented, but I feel like with my experiences
um and everything, like, the only thing that separates me from them is a
number is uh a card. And for me, like I said, I feel like at any moment
that could have been me. So I really see myself as, you know, someone from
the community and I don't like to sort of separate myself from dreamers
because like I said, the only thing separating us is like a piece of paper.
You know, we're all people that you want to make a difference. We all
have dreams, we all have goals, ambitions. Um So I don't really like to
separate myself from them because at the end of the day, the only thing
that does quote unquote, separate us is a piece of paper and, you know,
that shouldn't be reason enough to not incorporate myself within that
community. So I say an ally because I myself, I'm not undocumented. But at
the same time, you know, I feel like in reality, we're all one and the
same. So I kind of see myself as a leader and as someone who wants to, you
know, make a difference um within the community. So, all right. And then
with that, um how do you feel about the term dreamer and documented? Um I
feel like it's kind of, it, it helps stigmatize. Um I don't, I personally
don't like calling people dreamers are documented because that kind of,
like I said, separates them from, you know, everybody else. And I feel
like we need to just start incorporating like all these, you know, like
immigrants and like everyone just together because I feel like that kind
of sends a message of like, that's them. And we're us instead of saying
like, we're all in this fight together in this movement together. Um So I
personally don't like either the word documented or dreamer because at the
end of the day, I feel like that just kind of puts a stigma on people and
instead of really unifying and bringing them together? OK. And then how do
you, how do you feel about one of the movements slogans that was
undocumented and afraid
how I feel about that slogan. Um I think is very powerful because uh and
personally, like my parents were undocumented for a long time and they
were afraid um for a very, very long time and I feel like undocumented and
unafraid, kind of just helps people realize or kind of like the elephant
in the room. Like people are undocumented and they say, oh, I'm not afraid
, like whatever, like I'm not scared, but in reality, people are and I
feel like pointing that out, kind of gives people an opportunity to come
out of the shadows and, and seeing as to how other people are, like you
said, quote unquote undocumented and afraid it gets people who are afraid
to kind of like um an opportunity to come out. Um and not be afraid. So.
Ok. Um And then do you feel that immigration reform should be focused at
like the local state or federal level? I feel like it should be focused on
at every level, but more importantly, locally, because I feel like at the
end of the day, local change can come quicker and we have more of an
impact and more to say um locally than we do nationally, you know, we can
try and you know, pressure Obama and everything. But at the end of the day
, change for me starts locally in your communities, you know, standing up
, whether it's, you know, a friend who doesn't vote, telling them to vote
or, you know, different things like that because for me, like I've seen
changes happen locally and I know it can happen. Um but, you know, I'm not
that I'm not saying that, you know, global or national change isn't
achievable. But if everybody came together locally and started to organize
and, you know, really push for change, then that would eventually lead to
like a domino effect and create national change. Um So I think for me,
more importantly, local change is what's more effective. OK. Um And then
how do you find out about like events going on within the Dreamer movement
or the immigration movement? Like, how do you keep in touch? Like how well
social media, as I think a really big part. Um You know, I follow all
these different groups, I'm friends with all these different like
activists and um I see anytime they post something or any events that are
going on uh as long as, as well as through email, but more than anything
it's through, you know, social media that I find out about events and
stuff like that and also like networks that I know of reaching out. Uh And
then you said that your parents had been undocumented for a really long
time. Um Are they no longer undocumented. No, they are no longer
undocumented because when I turned 21 I petitioned for them and I was, I
was able to get them, you know, get their residency and stuff like that
through, through the petitioning process. So, and how do you feel about
these quote unquote dreamers? Um not having a pathway to citizenship like
your parents did. It upsets me a lot because
at the end of the day, like people know that if we, you know, give these
students a pathway to citizenship that's gonna, I guess, get them out of
office and get them out of power and they're afraid. And I feel like this
is a perfect example. Um that shows that, you know, united, like we're
very, very strong and if we could vote, then things would be way different.
Um So, and I'm sort of, I guess upset that there is no pathway to
citizenship citizenship, but I feel like just because there isn't one now
doesn't mean there can't be one. Sure.
All right. And then,
all right, um
you said something about coming out of the shadows earlier. Um when it's
least said they said undocumented and unafraid. So the slope there used to
be um I guess before there was this part of the movement where it kind of
said there was like no fault of their own. So it kind of put the blame on
the parents that, you know, it was not their fault. How did it. How did
you feel about that when, you know, they, um, obviously it's changed now.
Um, and we want, with the push for D A and D A, it's, we're pushing,
they're pushing for their parents as well. But I know before it was, like
, focus on the dreamers or like the undocumented students um that, you
know, no fault of their own and, like, politicians would use that as, you
know, it's not their fault and kind of blaming the parents. How do you
feel about that? Because you, your parents are undocumented? So. Mhm. Um I
feel like they could have used, I mean, I know they're not using that any
longer but I feel like, and at that point in time it maybe was good for
them to use because I mean, they were trying to get the focus on just
themselves and in a way, you know, it did help but I would have personally
try and not used it because like you were saying, it puts the fault on the
parents and then there's people who think of the more like 11 million
undocumented people that just come here to steal jobs or whatever it may
be and it kind of puts them in that light and saying, oh, it was my
parents' fault that I'm here. So it's like you're saying, putting the
blame on the parent and I don't think that was fair for either of those
either for the dreamer or for the parent because at the end of the day,
that parent's here to make a better life. And yes, it may have been, I
guess their fault but just saying it wasn't our fault or, you know, kind
of they were brought here, you know, on their own, kind of just really
makes that blame more real. And I don't think it's fair for the parents
who risked, in my case, in my parents' case, who risked their lives to
come here to give us a better life. It kind of like, I don't know, I
personally don't, don't like it. And I feel like it does kind of put a
negative light on the people who aren't dreamers who are still
undocumented like the parents um because those were my friends for a long
time. So I personally don't like it and don't agree on the use of it
because yeah, I mean, it's not their fault but you kind of kind of when
you say that it's like you're kind of washing your hands and saying like,
it's not my fault, it's their fault, but it belongs to somebody else. And
I feel like instead of unifying both movements of, you know, parents, you
know, immigration reform, but also, you know, like a dream act since the
beginning would have made it a lot stronger. Um And who knows where we
would have been now if that had happened. Um But I feel like by saying
it's not our fault kind of divides instead of unifying both, both things.
OK. And with that, um you did say like, you know, those people that aren't
dreamers. Um And I know you talked about how you don't like the term
dreamer because it stigmatizes dreamers are usually seen as, you know, the
model student. How do you feel about, you know, those students who
technically don't fall under that um dream dreamer, you know, criteria
under the Dream Act um like, is that why you don't like the term dreamer
or is it more of like, it kind of puts the blame on the parents too? Um I
think
that's why one of the reason why I don't like it because um at the end of
the day, there's various reasons as to why a student coming from that
background may have not been the best student at school, you know, may
have not graduated high school. I feel like there's a lot of things that
play into that and especially when you, let's say you're undocumented and
you have all these things already against you. But let's say, maybe you
don't have the support from your family to say, hey, get good grades. Like
, you know, go to college, maybe you didn't graduate from high school. But
that doesn't mean you can't be good society that doesn't mean that you
didn't do it just because you were lazy. There's a lot of factors that
could influence that like, maybe you couldn't graduate from high school
because a lot of things going on at home. But I feel like with the term
dreamer, like you were saying, it kind of divides those people from like
the good students or the good quote unquote dreamers, which is bad. And I
don't like that because instead of again, like that just divides instead
of unifying, you know, this, this movement because like, personally, for
me, like, I personally know a family that are dreamers or it could be
quote unquote dreamers. But let's say if the Dream Act passed, they
couldn't apply for it because they themselves had different things going
on in their lives where there was personal um that maybe didn't allow them
to graduate high school or maybe they got hung out with the wrong crowd.
Um So I feel like with the term Dream Act and it only incorporating a
specific number of people, um It kind of kind of stigmatizes or puts kind
of labels, people who don't fall under the Dream act as bad or as people
that we don't want in our country. When in reality, we don't know the
entire situation of what actually happened, you know, in their lives. So I
feel like it kind of in a way negatively affects other people, other I
guess non dreamers that are undocumented as they're the bad ones. Um Like
I said, I personally don't think that's fair for them because as a
community, we don't know what happened. We don't, who are we to blame and
who are we to judge as to why they don't fall under specific criteria? Um
So that's why I don't. And then how do you, do you feel like you said that
DACA was something for, you know, the movements and organizations to work
for and that unified them? Do you feel it's the ultimate goal or if it's
just like a step toward getting to where it should be?
I think it's just one of the many steps as a, as a community we need to
take to, you know, eventually in reality, like unify, like all of these
Muslims together, it's a great first step, you know, and I feel like it,
it made a lot of these organizations realize like, OK, now we have
something to work towards, but at the same time, it also kind of is a
realization that the work is not done and the work's not over and that
just because DACA or D A may have passed or whatever it may be that that's
going to change everything else and that's going to make everything all
better. Um I really hope that all these, you know, organizations working,
you know, to get help students of DACA and parents of DAPA. Um I really
hope that's not where it ends. And I really hope that a lot of these
organizations continue to, you know, help be the voice for for the, for
their communities because like I said, for me, I don't think that that's
where it's over and that's just the beginning of a lot of work that still
needs to be done. So I really hope that these orgs kind of don't just
focus on DACA and then like, disappear and I hope they continue working
towards really unifying um the movement and incorporating other, other
people into, into this so bigger than I think.