WEBVTT 00:00:01.740 --> 00:00:06.236 it looks like you've seen the college change obviously from the beginning 00:00:06.269 --> 00:00:11.066 um you know when did you move part of the college up to the community 00:00:11.099 --> 00:00:18.556 services building where we are today, that happened after I left? Um I 00:00:18.589 --> 00:00:23.256 think they had one office or two offices over here during that last year I 00:00:23.289 --> 00:00:28.706 was here but they just simply simply ran out of space. 00:00:28.739 --> 00:00:32.027 What do you think about the move that they're they're working on now to 00:00:32.060 --> 00:00:38.256 move the whole college downtown? I think it's already there and that I 00:00:38.289 --> 00:00:46.289 hope it works. Um I think that it will be a while before the whole 00:00:47.090 --> 00:00:53.266 building is utilized as they hope because it is a change and but maybe it 00:00:53.299 --> 00:00:59.037 will draw more students from the phoenix area. 00:00:59.070 --> 00:01:03.177 It looks it's a beautiful building, certainly much different from having 00:01:03.210 --> 00:01:08.697 it on the college campus here. Well yes and I have a personal preference. 00:01:08.730 --> 00:01:14.796 I would like to see nursing students being able to intermingle 00:01:14.829 --> 00:01:19.507 satisfactorily satisfactorily with the rest of the students in the 00:01:19.540 --> 00:01:24.706 university because I think it broadens their viewpoint in their whole 00:01:24.739 --> 00:01:29.697 aspect of of what education is about. 00:01:29.730 --> 00:01:37.730 Did did you have while you were here, the campus on the west side, they 00:01:38.620 --> 00:01:44.107 started a campus on the west side. Yes while I was still here and that was 00:01:44.140 --> 00:01:50.406 very successful and it's still very successful. It's growing a lot and it 00:01:50.439 --> 00:01:56.397 had its own school of nursing. It was it was this called the College of 00:01:56.430 --> 00:02:02.266 Nursing A. S. U. West. So they taught most of the courses on the upper 00:02:02.299 --> 00:02:10.299 level the for the students. So they had student practice there and in that 00:02:10.569 --> 00:02:15.967 general area and there's some very good hospitals there in that area to 00:02:16.000 --> 00:02:21.807 which allow the students to get the kind of practice they need there. And 00:02:21.840 --> 00:02:27.517 so of course the health department is everywhere in the county. Well we're 00:02:27.550 --> 00:02:32.756 here today about there being such a shortage of nurses. That's true. How 00:02:32.789 --> 00:02:36.916 do you feel about that? I think that it would be nice if there weren't 00:02:36.949 --> 00:02:43.647 nurses. Uh But what do you mean? Why do you think there is a shortage of 00:02:43.680 --> 00:02:48.946 nurses? People are becoming more aware of their health needs? I think for 00:02:48.979 --> 00:02:55.277 one thing and hospitals are growing and and people are getting older and 00:02:55.310 --> 00:03:02.106 the older population, do you need more 00:03:02.139 --> 00:03:07.397 attention to their health? I think that's not for all of the population. 00:03:07.430 --> 00:03:12.106 But that's true generally and 00:03:12.139 --> 00:03:16.807 there just aren't enough people who are interested in going into nursing 00:03:16.840 --> 00:03:23.846 or it was a few years back and now that it's a popular thing to do, the 00:03:23.879 --> 00:03:30.927 schools are all receiving more applications than they can take care of. So 00:03:30.960 --> 00:03:34.367 do you think that schools need to to expand and be able to, I think 00:03:34.400 --> 00:03:40.747 they'll have to or there will be more shortages. You were at the college 00:03:40.780 --> 00:03:44.997 during the time in the late 70s when women, more women started becoming 00:03:45.030 --> 00:03:49.997 doctors instead of nurses, did you see a change then when women were more 00:03:50.030 --> 00:03:57.696 able to become doctors? Yes I think that's true That didn't happen and and 00:03:57.729 --> 00:04:03.457 still is happening and that's fine. You know I think it's good that we 00:04:03.490 --> 00:04:09.707 have our own doctors and even Hilary is running for president. 00:04:09.740 --> 00:04:15.126 So they're women are getting more and more into every occupation. Do you 00:04:15.159 --> 00:04:19.406 think women make better doctors than men sometimes? 00:04:19.439 --> 00:04:23.517 Well there are male doctors that are fine and they're female doctors that 00:04:23.550 --> 00:04:30.077 are fine. But I don't know do you think that hurt the nursing profession 00:04:30.110 --> 00:04:34.687 when women started becoming doctors? That it was kind of like maybe maybe 00:04:34.720 --> 00:04:37.406 that's part of the problem. 00:04:37.439 --> 00:04:42.387 But I think that many other occupations became available to women and they 00:04:42.420 --> 00:04:48.577 run this perspective of what they might be able to do. So there were more 00:04:48.610 --> 00:04:54.406 women in various areas then there were 00:04:54.439 --> 00:04:58.856 when you became a nurse there weren't that many options. I know you 00:04:58.889 --> 00:05:05.627 probably were actually, I wanted to be an aviator. I thought it would be 00:05:05.660 --> 00:05:11.217 wonderful to fly an airplane and my mother said no. So that's settled that. 00:05:11.250 --> 00:05:15.837 But uh and I thought about becoming a teacher but I really wanted to be a 00:05:15.870 --> 00:05:21.306 nurse. But those were the two professions that were acceptable, generally 00:05:21.339 --> 00:05:28.527 speaking teaching and and uh at least where I lived, there were not any 00:05:28.560 --> 00:05:34.197 other avenues for women very much they were secretaries and they were 00:05:34.230 --> 00:05:42.230 teachers or are even nursing was limited in those days. 00:05:42.839 --> 00:05:47.286 So how do you feel about all the changes that you've seen. Well I think 00:05:47.319 --> 00:05:54.496 change is wonderful if it's if it's good change and uh otherwise I I feel 00:05:54.529 --> 00:05:59.106 all of society is constantly trying to adjust all the changes we have, 00:05:59.139 --> 00:06:03.306 don't you think? Yeah. 00:06:03.339 --> 00:06:08.306 Did you ever think that you'd see a s you grow to become as big as it is? 00:06:08.339 --> 00:06:14.707 Well, I didn't think about it, but it certainly is has grown, hasn't it? 00:06:14.740 --> 00:06:19.207 And the programs are really very well thought through. I think it's a 00:06:19.240 --> 00:06:21.507 great university. 00:06:21.540 --> 00:06:26.077 Can you sort of just describe the changes that you've seen that just at 00:06:26.110 --> 00:06:29.207 the College of nursing? 00:06:29.240 --> 00:06:36.457 Well, it's it's grown larger certainly. And otherwise, I think the basics 00:06:36.490 --> 00:06:41.656 are the same, only there are different approaches to educating the 00:06:41.689 --> 00:06:47.387 students in different areas. And I think that's fine too. What kind of 00:06:47.420 --> 00:06:50.507 different approaches? Well, 00:06:50.540 --> 00:06:56.217 it used to be that there had to be a a faculty immediately with a student 00:06:56.250 --> 00:07:02.046 all the time or merely all the time. But now the students are given 00:07:02.079 --> 00:07:09.687 directions and given an introduction to an area and are more on their own 00:07:09.720 --> 00:07:15.286 and then they report back to their instructor and that's fine. As long as 00:07:15.319 --> 00:07:20.207 the students have adequate preparation 00:07:20.240 --> 00:07:23.616 has the whole field of nursing, it seems like become more complicated as 00:07:23.649 --> 00:07:28.207 medicine has become more sophisticated. 00:07:28.240 --> 00:07:36.240 I think the basics in nursing remain the same. Um The nurse is able to 00:07:36.459 --> 00:07:44.459 understand and do more now than they were earlier days and it was more 00:07:44.939 --> 00:07:50.996 sort of in the early days more folk medicine because they didn't know more 00:07:51.029 --> 00:07:56.507 and the doctors didn't know more either. What are the basics of nursing 00:07:56.540 --> 00:08:04.540 competency and understanding health and illness and what kinds of things 00:08:05.300 --> 00:08:13.300 promote health versus uh the things that promote illness and being able to 00:08:14.740 --> 00:08:21.077 be knowledgeable about the new developments in medicine and in nursing to 00:08:21.110 --> 00:08:27.317 take care of the patient and two be available at the level that the 00:08:27.350 --> 00:08:32.207 patient needs to be helped. 00:08:32.240 --> 00:08:37.506 What's the best memory that you have of A. S. U. 00:08:37.539 --> 00:08:43.006 They were all very pleasant memories. I really don't have any complaints. 00:08:43.039 --> 00:08:48.506 So I don't have any worst memories. 00:08:48.539 --> 00:08:54.476 Well it was it was a wonderful place to work for me. I liked it and I like 00:08:54.509 --> 00:09:00.386 the people I worked with and the the people that I didn't work with too 00:09:00.419 --> 00:09:04.756 much. For instance, I think that the people in the graduate college were 00:09:04.789 --> 00:09:08.986 so helpful when we were developing that masters program. They were just 00:09:09.019 --> 00:09:16.077 wonderful. And uh so it was helpful to the whole college and therefore to 00:09:16.110 --> 00:09:18.506 the whole community. 00:09:18.539 --> 00:09:22.717 Are there any particular students that stand out in your mind? Oh yes, 00:09:22.750 --> 00:09:30.750 many of them. Well we've had some wonderful indian students who I was so 00:09:31.049 --> 00:09:36.146 pleased that that they were able to be in and do the master's program and 00:09:36.179 --> 00:09:43.817 then become leaders themselves in their own areas and that I'm 00:09:43.850 --> 00:09:47.677 particularly impressed by then, we didn't have very many black students 00:09:47.710 --> 00:09:53.386 and I'm sorry about that. I don't know why, I guess the recruitment, it 00:09:53.419 --> 00:09:59.907 wasn't geared towards towards the black student. I don't know, we had some 00:09:59.940 --> 00:10:05.856 which was good and we had students from different countries and that was 00:10:05.889 --> 00:10:09.876 an exciting, exciting thing for the whole college because we learned from 00:10:09.909 --> 00:10:14.807 them and they learned from us. Why would they come from other countries? 00:10:14.840 --> 00:10:18.106 Because they hear about the program, 00:10:18.139 --> 00:10:23.907 Do they come to become nurses here or to go home and to go home? Mainly 00:10:23.940 --> 00:10:28.996 about mexican american nurses. And we've had plenty of those and they've 00:10:29.029 --> 00:10:34.947 all been wonderful. They've gone back to their communities or stayed in 00:10:34.980 --> 00:10:42.807 the community there in and or just sought new jobs depending upon their 00:10:42.840 --> 00:10:50.840 preference for and their reason for being here in the first place. 00:10:51.440 --> 00:10:57.207 How would you like to be remembered by the people of the college nursing? 00:10:57.240 --> 00:10:59.506 Um 00:10:59.539 --> 00:11:07.539 Well, if anybody chooses to remember me, I would like them to think of me 00:11:07.720 --> 00:11:13.307 as as someone who was a friend of theirs. 00:11:13.340 --> 00:11:18.266 I suppose. I have had a couple of people who didn't like me very well, but 00:11:18.299 --> 00:11:24.636 I don't know. I mean everybody does if you're in a position of 00:11:24.669 --> 00:11:29.606 responsibility, but 00:11:29.639 --> 00:11:33.606 they could think of me as they wish. 00:11:33.639 --> 00:11:37.467 Is there anything that you accomplished? I think you did a lot of things 00:11:37.500 --> 00:11:40.907 over the years that your proudest. 00:11:40.940 --> 00:11:46.746 I think um probably getting the program going in the first place when I 00:11:46.779 --> 00:11:52.837 first came back day issue. and I think that was really, we really worked 00:11:52.870 --> 00:11:59.266 on on that, that those few of us who were here and also the establishment 00:11:59.299 --> 00:12:06.177 of the master's program which was a hard thing to do. Initially we had to 00:12:06.210 --> 00:12:10.657 put a lot of work in on that and then the clinic, 00:12:10.690 --> 00:12:15.756 the development of the clinic and the whole concept of having the students 00:12:15.789 --> 00:12:19.606 be able to become a nurse practitioner. 00:12:19.639 --> 00:12:24.327 Was that pretty new when you started? Yes, it was. 00:12:24.360 --> 00:12:27.646 That's different. That's different than a physician's assistant. Yes, it 00:12:27.679 --> 00:12:33.187 is because they have a broader education then the physician physician's 00:12:33.220 --> 00:12:41.220 assistant, they have the whole earlier Masters Bachelor Bachelor of 00:12:41.470 --> 00:12:47.606 Science in Nursing and the master's in nursing in addition to the other 00:12:47.639 --> 00:12:53.106 material that they get as being a nurse practitioner. 00:12:53.139 --> 00:12:57.346 Did you ever miss actually doing hands on nursing as you became more 00:12:57.379 --> 00:13:02.687 involved in running the college? No, because I did occasionally get into 00:13:02.720 --> 00:13:09.967 that. Uh I can't say that. I didn't really miss it because I was so 00:13:10.000 --> 00:13:13.807 involved with other things which which helped other people to do those 00:13:13.840 --> 00:13:16.707 things. 00:13:16.740 --> 00:13:20.126 What kind of advice would you give to young people that are starting off 00:13:20.159 --> 00:13:24.307 trying to decide what they want to do as a career, what they want to do 00:13:24.340 --> 00:13:31.596 with goodbyes? Well, I think that that if they aren't sure they need to 00:13:31.629 --> 00:13:39.307 make up their mind if they can and if they can't then most of them do 00:13:39.340 --> 00:13:43.947 enroll in college And while they're trying to decide, I mean many of them 00:13:43.980 --> 00:13:50.177 do what they really want to do and I think if they really pick something 00:13:50.210 --> 00:13:55.047 that they like and they want to do they should devote their efforts to 00:13:55.080 --> 00:14:02.396 finding out what's entailed in that and to make a decision and and go for 00:14:02.429 --> 00:14:04.986 it. 00:14:05.019 --> 00:14:07.587 I think I've covered most of the questions I had for you. Is there 00:14:07.620 --> 00:14:10.447 anything you wanted to tell us that I didn't ask? You know, I think you've 00:14:10.480 --> 00:14:17.307 covered everything and more bob. Did you have anything you wanted to ask 00:14:17.340 --> 00:14:23.807 you? You mentioned doing quite a bit of research. Yeah. 00:14:23.840 --> 00:14:30.037 If some of that research happened in the issue or probably yes, I did 00:14:30.070 --> 00:14:38.070 publish most of the research. I was oh okay. Yes. Um um I did was involved 00:14:41.480 --> 00:14:46.476 with research at at the University of Chicago. And the topic that I did. 00:14:46.509 --> 00:14:50.106 My main research in was 00:14:50.139 --> 00:14:58.139 the hospitalized child and three I had three groups, 1 who had a sit her 00:14:59.259 --> 00:15:03.967 with her or someone who was a mother substitute and the child who had his 00:15:04.000 --> 00:15:12.000 mother with with her or him and the child who had nobody there to comfort 00:15:12.379 --> 00:15:17.976 him. And I did a comparison of those three groups. And it took me forever 00:15:18.009 --> 00:15:22.636 to get it done because I observed in the hospital recorded those 00:15:22.669 --> 00:15:30.669 observations and then um Compared to three groups and I found that the 00:15:33.149 --> 00:15:38.077 child who did not have anybody with them, of course, you might expect, was 00:15:38.110 --> 00:15:43.587 very sad and lonely child. And the child who had the substitute mother 00:15:43.620 --> 00:15:47.860 with her or him. Where's?