so what was a s you like, What year did you come here, 68, 68. It had only
been a university Really less than 10 years at the time. Um And most of
the people were originally hired in in the initial hiring process. Um Dean
lea Thompson was the Dean of Engineering and he had started the
engineering school from scratch, like all the other colleges, business and
engineering were strong colleges at that time. And for several years after
that, partly on the the personalities of the two deans, but Thompson had
come here, was hired to become uh to be the founding dean of engineering
56, so long before the vote to make it a university and was strong
participant in getting at the referendum passed and all that. And it was a
very
uh teachers college philosophy, it had always been a teacher's college.
All the administrators university were teachers,
the strong philosophy at the time, which certainly Dean Thompson had was
that our purpose in Arizona was to educate the citizenry of Arizona. Our
job was to provide educational opportunities so that they could pursue
their areas of interest to prepare them for life and that was our sole job.
There was very little interest and certainly no encouragement to do
research, which I found a little disappointing because that's what my
primary interest really was. And so um the whole atmosphere,
I was teaching oriented, very good teachers for the most part, not all the
faculty then were phds
that wasn't a requirement kind of thing in those days and that was sort of
the transition of american universities in general and uh, 60s of sort of
requiring that and sufficient pool of graduates that they could, could
require before that have been a little difficult, certainly in areas like
engineering. So it was a different environment, there was really no
encouragement to work with industry and of course I was coming from
industry. Uh first of all, they don't give you any credit for having
worked in industry and academia,
but um, I, I remember Dean Thompson telling me that uh, we shouldn't
accept any gifts from, from equipment or anything else from industry,
which is quite contrary to what I spent a lot of my life doing. What was
his. Well, that if they give you something and you're obligated to do
something for them and we need to be independent and not obliging to
anyone or any sector or whatever. So it was
maybe a little idealistic but more the traditional educator point of view
that we're looked at from society as independent, credible sources of
information and if you get tainted in some way that you owe somebody
something and that would undermine that kind of image and reputation
when I got here
the West Valley. But it was represented in the legislature about some very
strong people, what they wanted was a campus in things.
The university had never really thought of itself in terms of what it
meant to be in phoenix when I got here, fresh from the outside world, it
seemed to me that the biggest advantage that Arizona state had in
competition with the other two institutions of the state or within
competition competition of other institutions in the broader there it is,
was our location in a city that was the largest population concentration
anywhere in the southwest,
where there was enormous economic activity that the university could
relate to and wasn't one of the things that we boost, we're being
criticized for not trying to serve people in the west Valley.
What was it about the issue that was appealing the regions had just
approved a new mission statement for Arizona State University, which was
to transform itself into a major research university. And I had spent what
20 years at that point in major research universities, first at the
university of Minnesota and subsequently at the University of Colorado.
And so I had, I felt that I knew something about major research
universities, about their special needs, about their goals, about the
kinds of work they did and that I could make a contribution in helping a s
you to transform itself from primarily a teaching institution into a major
research university. And I thought there was a lot of work to do to make
that transition.
We did some things that I think have turned out to be, but profitable for
the institution, not always popular at the time. One of them was just the
concept that we promote ourselves as the university in phoenix and that we
encourage our people to use their academic skills to contribute to things
and its continued growth prosperity and to the students who lived in
things and wanted to attend the university.
Later on, I worked at principal at Wright State, it became part of natural
movement join institutions of this kind. Yeah, she was a little big two
probably. Um but our focus on serving local companies like intel. Mhm.
Lead to a, an emphasis on the engineering at the end of time. Rolling
Hayden call it engineering excellence. Mm hmm. Today, the College of
Engineering and the issue is widely admired as being one 50 years old,
best engineering school in the country. You could not have said that about.
Yeah, right.
But because Sully Sullenberger, Yeah. Other local levers tell her who was
director of Salt River Project at that time, Jack Jack Jack Pfister. That
that group of business people took seriously the idea that we were trying
to serve the local interest research programs. They were responsible for
additional funding and help with the legislature. That led to the
expansion of and the improvement the College of Engineering. And that's a
that's a success story.
Let's take this issue of the university's role as a significant engine in
the economic dynamics of this community. It's still evolving how it is,
what it is. How does it work with Tgn, how does it work with bioscience,
how does it work with the technology transfers going on at the Sky Song
campus. So there are tangible elements that were not foreseen 10 years ago
having people understand
that those tangible elements can develop and and to understand what kind
of interplay needs to take place within the university and therefore why
research and why technology transfer and why a series of these things
where you're bringing very talented people here is important. It's
interesting. Uh every most everybody in a leadership position has a
personal experience with education.
They went to college, they went to college. That's a that's a that's an
important experience. We do a miserable job of teaching our students, but
the larger set of things are going on around them as part of the
university. And as a result of that, people think of their college
experience and let's assume it's a good, it was a good experience and
that's what they think of as what the university is. Well, it is that, but
it's substantially more and so yeah,
finding ways both for the university and its own community where people
are, are historically trained to be focused on very specific problems
to have helped them understand how it connects not only with other
disciplines but to the larger issues of society and to have the community
understand not only how good these people are, but how relevant they are
is an ongoing teaching job, I believe, just to give you an example of what
one would not normally think of, that. One of the most significant ways in
which a issue has advanced that understanding in this community is the
President's community Enrichment program, something that my wife Elva put
together where faculty members go out into people's homes in the community
and lecture on everything from the origins of space and origins of life
and origins of society. I mean, experts, world class experts that we have
on this faculty, two issues of Iraq and religion and conflict and all of
the things that go on in that endeavor. It's uh stimulating to our
community visitors because it's stimulating their interesting topics. It's
impressive because they see these very, very bright able people. It's also
instructive that they see, oh, I see how that set of things leads to a
strength at the university and exploration of mars and interplanetary
science. I see how that can relate to space science as part of an economy
etcetera etcetera.
How would you describe the relationship between ASU and its communities
during your time here? I I thought that we professors were not at the time
rewarded for what we did in the community and that is always what I
thought I should do. And I I resented that there was so much emphasis on
my research when the I like doing research. I enjoy doing it. I did a lot
of it. But I thought the emphasis should be on all three. I mean, there
were three legs of the stool that nick Henry had and it was, it was
service teaching and research.
It was a voice that all three were important and you need all three for a
stool. But one of the legs of the stool was not particularly strong. But I
think now there's a lot more with the new president now or not so new with
Crow, a lot more emphasis on getting the community. I like to see that
happen now,
maybe I'm wrong. But it seems, I think you're right. It seems more get my
university. My first university was University of Wisconsin and they said
the universe, the borders of the university are the borders of the state.
Sorry, I grew up with that idea that a university should encompassed the
whole state. And I think she was trying to do that now and I I'm proud
that I was here for such a long time. 27 28 years. A long time.