WEBVTT 00:00:03.000 --> 00:00:05.000 Next, we examine the educational aspect of the Arcosanti workshop. Many 00:00:07.280 --> 00:00:11.005 people expect it to be more of an educational institution than it is. Our 00:00:11.038 --> 00:00:14.945 facilities have not allowed us at this time to put too much emphasis on 00:00:14.978 --> 00:00:20.512 the teaching. So the intellectual life or the social life is limited. It's 00:00:20.545 --> 00:00:24.282 almost non existent. An important part of the workshop experience is that 00:00:24.315 --> 00:00:28.831 weekly meeting Soleri has with all participants has a basic understanding 00:00:28.864 --> 00:00:31.811 of what Solari is about. Or even if he's read, you know, he's plowed his 00:00:31.844 --> 00:00:34.521 way through about becoming spirit or sitting in the image of man. But the 00:00:34.554 --> 00:00:38.226 point is if you come here, um I mean, for example, I read a lot of that 00:00:38.259 --> 00:00:44.207 stuff and yet I come, I came here expecting or hoping for clarification 00:00:44.240 --> 00:00:50.265 and a real, you know, a real perspective on all of that, which that's 00:00:50.298 --> 00:00:52.695 what's meetings are for. He's not going to lecture you, you have to ask 00:00:52.728 --> 00:00:55.536 the questions and that's what the whole thing is. If you come here with a 00:00:55.569 --> 00:00:58.557 question, he'll answer them to the best of his ability. And you can even 00:00:58.590 --> 00:01:02.385 ask him the same question every time and he'll go into it every meeting, 00:01:02.418 --> 00:01:05.915 but that's what he comes here for. But nobody's you come here. This is, 00:01:05.948 --> 00:01:08.876 this is not a classroom experience. They also said that in the brochure, 00:01:08.909 --> 00:01:13.286 we are interested in augmenting the educational elements that we can offer 00:01:13.319 --> 00:01:20.036 here. And I think this will begin in 1975 and become much more obvious in 00:01:20.069 --> 00:01:25.516 1976. But still the accent is on construction and the learning process has 00:01:25.549 --> 00:01:32.326 to be found there. Fundamentally, I've been doing pre casting glazing and 00:01:32.359 --> 00:01:36.117 digging in the pit 00:01:36.150 --> 00:01:40.165 construction experience before you came here. No, it was pretty easy 00:01:40.198 --> 00:01:44.036 working in the pit. All I had to do was pick up a chisel and chisel rocks 00:01:44.069 --> 00:01:50.507 all the glazing. Um I just followed Tim around for a while until I caught 00:01:50.540 --> 00:01:54.745 on to what he was doing. And the same thing with Charlie when I was doing 00:01:54.778 --> 00:01:59.227 pre casting, I was interested in that. So I asked if I could work with him. 00:01:59.260 --> 00:02:03.516 That's what I really like doing the most carpentry. It's been a long time 00:02:03.549 --> 00:02:06.947 , building forms and 00:02:06.980 --> 00:02:11.267 finish carpentry. That's just up the hill and just do all kinds of 00:02:11.300 --> 00:02:17.797 projects of my own camp. Cosmic Kin Sunscreening. What kind of work? And 00:02:17.830 --> 00:02:21.987 what kind of Sunscreening have you been doing? Arco soI T shirts. This is 00:02:22.020 --> 00:02:27.835 what we've been working on for the whole six weeks. We poured 4 1000 £250 00:02:27.868 --> 00:02:33.517 concrete planters, 7 ft six by 19 by 17. If we had a little more time, 00:02:33.550 --> 00:02:40.055 we'd plant them after the chain hut, our ton and a half chain hoist that 00:02:40.088 --> 00:02:45.255 is uh used to roll over each of these flower pots because we cast them 00:02:45.288 --> 00:02:50.346 upside down other tasks on the site such as welding, plumbing and 00:02:50.379 --> 00:02:53.936 operating and maintaining. The heavy equipment tends to be done by staff 00:02:53.969 --> 00:02:59.376 members, John Sandgren. A works hopper comments on the work scene as a 00:02:59.409 --> 00:03:03.025 whole. I think it is great. I have never seen anything like it before. 00:03:03.058 --> 00:03:08.585 People singing and whistling around the site is just phenomenal. Perhaps 00:03:08.618 --> 00:03:12.335 an outstanding example of the will to work is when a semi trailer load of 00:03:12.368 --> 00:03:17.967 cement in £90 bags arrives on the site. Everyone is marshaled to unload it 00:03:18.000 --> 00:03:22.555 into the cement shed 00:03:22.588 --> 00:03:26.646 just talking to our work 00:03:26.679 --> 00:03:31.835 back of us. 00:03:31.868 --> 00:03:35.886 No, sir, I don't think. Well, I think it's a pretty good crew. That's what 00:03:35.919 --> 00:03:39.755 I think you got a lot of people here. 00:03:39.788 --> 00:03:44.846 No, no, this is the first time I've been in here. No, they told me that 00:03:44.879 --> 00:03:48.116 I'd get unloaded pretty fast. They told me it would be by hand though. 00:03:48.149 --> 00:03:50.656 Yeah, they said that they'd get a bunch of people up here and really start 00:03:50.689 --> 00:03:57.386 going 12 minutes so far. You got to wait till the last bags in here. 00:03:57.419 --> 00:04:03.525 No, I scared who's got the last bag? 00:04:03.558 --> 00:04:09.116 I'll wait. I'll wait to be the last bag. 00:04:09.149 --> 00:04:13.475 Is there a record pending or is there, is this all, uh, what sort of prize 00:04:13.508 --> 00:04:17.205 do I win for being the last bag, 00:04:17.238 --> 00:04:21.377 don't you? Why don't you bite the bag, 00:04:21.410 --> 00:04:29.410 man? Let go 00:04:31.488 --> 00:04:36.776 get the day off. I think the people's will to work and to finish something 00:04:36.809 --> 00:04:42.526 that they have pride in is an advantage which you won't get in another 00:04:42.559 --> 00:04:48.616 construction site. Which, that's one reason I'm glad I came. I've learned 00:04:48.649 --> 00:04:53.197 so much in just doing it much more than a book had ever. Tell me how to do. 00:04:53.230 --> 00:04:58.067 How do you feel about Paulo's relationship to the construction work? The 00:04:58.100 --> 00:05:01.895 fact that he's here quite a bit of the time, at least once a week is a 00:05:01.928 --> 00:05:05.967 very good thing. Only because at this point in the Archology growth, it's 00:05:06.000 --> 00:05:11.257 essential that he be here to sort of oversee what's happening. And 00:05:11.290 --> 00:05:15.346 unfortunately, many times even in the real world is like, everyone seems 00:05:15.379 --> 00:05:20.705 to call it many, some architects never even see the buildings that their 00:05:20.738 --> 00:05:25.836 company has designed. And that is an architecture to me. So you feel that 00:05:25.869 --> 00:05:29.325 it's, it's good that Pard takes an interest in the smallest detail of the 00:05:29.358 --> 00:05:34.276 building. He's a visionary at heart and these times which he comes up to 00:05:34.309 --> 00:05:40.616 the site, I sort of give him some reality to the vision that he's sort of 00:05:40.649 --> 00:05:47.817 built in his mind and to see it being put into concrete and steel is a, is 00:05:47.850 --> 00:05:53.336 a nice thing and that maybe will mold some of his ideas as to the 00:05:53.369 --> 00:05:58.736 difficulty in building with this certain material and how it will work in 00:05:58.769 --> 00:06:03.086 the future. In others, I asked participants, how they feel about the idea 00:06:03.119 --> 00:06:06.687 of oncology. I think this is a really vital experiment that needs to be 00:06:06.720 --> 00:06:12.217 done. It's very interesting. So far, all my experiences of living in close 00:06:12.250 --> 00:06:19.046 quarters with people. Paul Steinberg have been negative ones. I think it 00:06:19.079 --> 00:06:23.236 could be good. I'm not really sure how it would be. We cannot, uh we 00:06:23.269 --> 00:06:29.366 couldn't survive if people that came here would be mainly skeptical or, or 00:06:29.399 --> 00:06:33.877 against the idea, it would be, would be too much. You need, you need some 00:06:33.910 --> 00:06:41.910 kind of oh support. I mean, the human individual support, people support. 00:06:43.869 --> 00:06:46.575 I think there would be a remarkable change in the second generation. 00:06:46.608 --> 00:06:51.336 People who are born here, born in an archology, the work that seems to be 00:06:51.369 --> 00:06:57.866 going on in the cities today, Bill Finney makes me feel that greed is 00:06:57.899 --> 00:07:03.786 really the process behind it. The city are really put together by a lot of 00:07:03.819 --> 00:07:08.226 different people. So it comes out as lots of pieces and the people seem to 00:07:08.259 --> 00:07:14.895 get short changed in the process where individuals are making money for 00:07:14.928 --> 00:07:20.096 themselves rather than making cities for people to live and have good 00:07:20.129 --> 00:07:24.596 environments in what seems to be happening. Here is the beginning of an 00:07:24.629 --> 00:07:30.176 organism which comes complete with all of the pieces. It is something that 00:07:30.209 --> 00:07:35.116 will bring the individuals together in an enlivening process, a very 00:07:35.149 --> 00:07:40.697 dynamic kind of city, the idea itself, if it wasn't attractive, I wouldn't 00:07:40.730 --> 00:07:44.955 be staying here. But although I don't, can't say I really believe in the 00:07:44.988 --> 00:07:52.257 concept of Archology, it seems the most viable possible possibility or 00:07:52.290 --> 00:07:55.596 idea to work towards a future at the moment. So I'm going to give it a 00:07:55.629 --> 00:08:01.096 shot. And what do you mean by? You don't believe me, I'm not so sure that 00:08:01.129 --> 00:08:05.745 by building a structure as power is designed it, you're necessarily going 00:08:05.778 --> 00:08:10.305 to produce a city which is free from a lot of the ills that plague other 00:08:10.338 --> 00:08:15.507 cities. It's an interesting possibility, but I don't believe in it. My God. 00:08:15.540 --> 00:08:18.317 Well, it's going to change people, you know, evolutionarily, you know, 00:08:18.350 --> 00:08:22.717 over a long period of time for sure. And it's like city have changed 00:08:22.750 --> 00:08:29.455 people from cavemen. But sometimes I really wonder like if Archos of a 00:08:29.488 --> 00:08:33.467 million people are really possible. But then I think, well, maybe not 00:08:33.500 --> 00:08:38.255 within my lifetime or, you know, 50 lifetimes from now, but I could see it 00:08:38.288 --> 00:08:41.475 happening eventually since I've only been here six weeks. I really don't 00:08:41.508 --> 00:08:46.956 have a feel of what's going on. I don't think I'm ready yet to criticize 00:08:46.989 --> 00:08:51.096 Paula on his work though. I think that at some point in time in the future 00:08:51.129 --> 00:08:54.495 , I should start thinking about that. I'm not the kind of person to 00:08:54.528 --> 00:08:59.427 swallow something whole. And I have criticisms that I'm working on but how 00:08:59.460 --> 00:09:02.736 valid they are. I don't know. I don't know. It's kind of an experiment on 00:09:02.769 --> 00:09:08.167 a small scale going on right now. We have a lot of people working here. 00:09:08.200 --> 00:09:11.356 The effort that's going into building this place is a worthwhile effort. 00:09:11.389 --> 00:09:16.467 It's something worthwhile for me to do with my energy. And whether or not 00:09:16.500 --> 00:09:20.816 it's going to work is a fascinating experiment that's going on now. And I 00:09:20.849 --> 00:09:24.866 , and working here, I'm part of that. It's an interesting idea. I 00:09:24.899 --> 00:09:27.385 certainly better than a lot of ideas that are being tried. Now. I think 00:09:27.418 --> 00:09:30.797 it's probably the most valid thing that we have for city designs today. I 00:09:30.830 --> 00:09:36.596 was skeptical. I thought it was the beginning of 1984 and Big Brother is 00:09:36.629 --> 00:09:44.135 watching, I feel it's different now that I think that the structure and 00:09:44.168 --> 00:09:49.787 the people that inhabit it will possibly change the path that man is 00:09:49.820 --> 00:09:53.236 headed for. I think it was against human nature. Mary Coogan, the Baker as 00:09:53.269 --> 00:09:56.086 people become more and more dense, they become more and more alienated 00:09:56.119 --> 00:10:01.525 from each other and things like high crime rates. People stop relating to 00:10:01.558 --> 00:10:04.816 other people as people and more as objects like furniture because they're 00:10:04.849 --> 00:10:09.275 so close. Do you find that to be true here 00:10:09.308 --> 00:10:12.385 when there are more people here? Yeah, I do find that true. The more 00:10:12.418 --> 00:10:16.287 people that are here, the more detached I personally become from them. I 00:10:16.320 --> 00:10:20.686 don't think that much thought has gone into the psychology of it. I think 00:10:20.719 --> 00:10:23.167 it's something that's expected to happen. I don't think it's just going to 00:10:23.200 --> 00:10:26.566 happen. I always have a vision of this one scene in Clockwork Orange is a 00:10:26.599 --> 00:10:31.515 beautiful apartment house. These murals on the walls and it was just a 00:10:31.548 --> 00:10:36.927 beautiful building was totally trashed. It was just the, the attitude of 00:10:36.960 --> 00:10:41.547 the people, the alienation of the people. And, uh, I don't see any, 00:10:41.580 --> 00:10:45.736 currently any drastic change in, in human development here as far as 00:10:45.769 --> 00:10:49.116 ability to relate to people. And I understand that's not supposed to come 00:10:49.149 --> 00:10:52.417 to the buildings are up. But I don't believe, I believe that furniture 00:10:52.450 --> 00:10:54.807 doesn't make a lot of difference. You have to change has to come from 00:10:54.840 --> 00:10:58.125 within. I think people should recognize the fact that they're going to 00:10:58.158 --> 00:11:02.525 have to change, to live there successfully and it's something that they're 00:11:02.558 --> 00:11:06.287 going to have to do and something the city is going to do for them, people 00:11:06.320 --> 00:11:11.346 set about changing. I think it's very highly personal thing because I, I 00:11:11.379 --> 00:11:15.586 don't think there's any anything, I don't think the way I change could be 00:11:15.619 --> 00:11:20.736 the way you change. I don't think it could change. People have to find out 00:11:20.769 --> 00:11:23.696 what inside themselves, alienates themselves from other people and 00:11:23.729 --> 00:11:29.407 separates them, go about changing that so that they are, they can react to 00:11:29.440 --> 00:11:34.616 people on a level where they even treat a stranger that they don't know in 00:11:34.649 --> 00:11:38.106 a way that they would like to be treated themselves. Jeff talks about how 00:11:38.139 --> 00:11:41.775 he has changed. Well, trying to be more tolerant to the people that you're 00:11:41.808 --> 00:11:47.557 living right next to and look, the feelings are the things that ta says 00:11:47.590 --> 00:11:52.686 about having a, a feeling of love for somebody who's, you know, for the 00:11:52.719 --> 00:11:55.375 other person. 00:11:55.408 --> 00:12:00.907 I could see that happening a little bit in me from being here. 00:12:00.940 --> 00:12:04.025 I'd like to see it happening a little bit more and a lot more than 00:12:04.058 --> 00:12:08.657 everybody here. But I don't know, that's a long time coming. I think I did 00:12:08.690 --> 00:12:13.696 the Erika 40 day training program in Vermont, Peter Calloway. It's kind of 00:12:13.729 --> 00:12:19.547 a spiritual mental health, the what you call it a program where they bring 00:12:19.580 --> 00:12:23.956 together various kinds of exercises and meditation, psychotherapeutic 00:12:23.989 --> 00:12:30.316 physical chanting, that sort of thing to bring you hopefully to some state 00:12:30.349 --> 00:12:35.696 of a higher awareness. And then this is another kind of trip. See, that's 00:12:35.729 --> 00:12:40.385 a, that's a, that kind of trip. The guy who started it, Oscar Kaza is kind 00:12:40.418 --> 00:12:42.446 of the idea is you're working on the inside of the person, you're trying 00:12:42.479 --> 00:12:44.895 to change individuals so that then they will change the world, the 00:12:44.928 --> 00:12:47.467 external. And then I came through this other kind of trip where Pablo 00:12:47.500 --> 00:12:51.427 o'leary wants to change the outside of the exterior world in order to 00:12:51.460 --> 00:12:56.645 change people. Kaza who founded Arika doesn't know how to necessarily how 00:12:56.678 --> 00:13:01.287 to design structures and that sort of thing. I think that he has a better 00:13:01.320 --> 00:13:06.375 developed philosophy, has a better organization. And although the problem 00:13:06.408 --> 00:13:10.515 of the problem he faces is that when people become more aware, what do 00:13:10.548 --> 00:13:14.746 they then do is the question. Now, one of the nice things about pallot is 00:13:14.779 --> 00:13:20.375 that he gives us something to do. And the problem is that what he's given 00:13:20.408 --> 00:13:23.326 us to do or the organizational form it to do it. And what he's given us to 00:13:23.359 --> 00:13:29.625 do is is not necessarily the form of it going to bring people either in 00:13:29.658 --> 00:13:33.807 the process of it or in the completion of it to a greater well being. I 00:13:33.840 --> 00:13:38.596 believe that it's, it has potential there, but it needs a hell of a lot of 00:13:38.629 --> 00:13:43.736 work Larry. But visiting San to check it out was so enthusiastic that he 00:13:43.769 --> 00:13:48.706 signed up for the first workshop of 1975. It's very exciting to think 00:13:48.739 --> 00:13:54.816 about making a contribution. I think in terms of my background, which is 00:13:54.849 --> 00:13:59.125 organizational development. And I see that there, there is probably a lot 00:13:59.158 --> 00:14:04.307 of energy that's available. A lot of resources here that are probably not 00:14:04.340 --> 00:14:07.375 used in the waste, which can't be afforded. What kind of things would have 00:14:07.408 --> 00:14:11.326 to be changed for this energy to be used, isense management planning or 00:14:11.359 --> 00:14:17.787 making sure that interrelated parts connect, for example, has there ever 00:14:17.820 --> 00:14:22.005 been a real stock taking? I mean, the whole community taking stock of 00:14:22.038 --> 00:14:28.505 itself and saying, hey, this is where we are in every dimension. And then 00:14:28.538 --> 00:14:33.566 really examining its resources that maybe are not tapped and then really 00:14:33.599 --> 00:14:39.005 seeing where we could be right now, the buildings are at a point where 00:14:39.038 --> 00:14:43.996 they can't go much farther unless we get proper assistance from money 00:14:44.029 --> 00:14:49.797 sources, research sources and consultants in various areas. I see also 00:14:49.830 --> 00:14:55.385 some sense that there must be some or suppression of human needs in terms 00:14:55.418 --> 00:14:59.167 of the overall goal. And I don't know whether that's even necessary, the 00:14:59.200 --> 00:15:02.746 kind of frictions and dissatisfaction, socially and spiritually they are 00:15:02.779 --> 00:15:08.596 here now have to be taken care of Robin Elmore. There is a resistance to 00:15:08.629 --> 00:15:13.927 matters, spiritual and intellectual or whatever you want to call being a 00:15:13.960 --> 00:15:18.177 part of the community life here. There's no doubt in my mind that if there 00:15:18.210 --> 00:15:22.417 are a lot of people here who have a heavy investment in being able to live 00:15:22.450 --> 00:15:26.846 a lifestyle where they can do construction work during the day and 00:15:26.879 --> 00:15:31.025 bullshit and drink beer at night, you know, which they happen to enjoy. It 00:15:31.058 --> 00:15:37.726 happens I think to be less satisfying for me, I don't go with that so much. 00:15:37.759 --> 00:15:42.326 I spend a lot more time alone, which is perhaps dissatisfying. Also, Tony 00:15:42.359 --> 00:15:47.297 Brown comments. If all we had to do was to sit here and survive at life, 00:15:47.330 --> 00:15:52.316 uh just grow enough food for everybody to greet and just build enough 00:15:52.349 --> 00:15:56.047 shelter to shelter the people here right now, we wouldn't really have any 00:15:56.080 --> 00:16:00.606 problem. We're trying to build a $45 million building. Well, that's the 00:16:00.639 --> 00:16:07.246 estimate using our labor, um using commercial labors about 130. So this 00:16:07.279 --> 00:16:11.047 whole thing about community and a sand and construction site has always 00:16:11.080 --> 00:16:15.537 been one of the, the big problems. Well, not big problems. There's been a 00:16:15.570 --> 00:16:19.807 problem that's gone through a lot of discussion. There's always the 00:16:19.840 --> 00:16:24.206 arguments of community versus construction site and the performance before 00:16:24.239 --> 00:16:27.625 structure, there's always been a point of difference between lots of 00:16:27.658 --> 00:16:31.927 people. Part of the premise of Archology is that the structure will 00:16:31.960 --> 00:16:34.186 perceive the performance. In other words, once you have the structure 00:16:34.219 --> 00:16:38.846 there, you become because of the constraints or the inputs of the building 00:16:38.879 --> 00:16:44.057 itself, you change the people that live within that structure. Now, it 00:16:44.090 --> 00:16:49.866 seems to me if we could get 3000 people living in tents on this site, 00:16:49.899 --> 00:16:55.135 produce a change uh uh evolutionary change in that group, then we're 00:16:55.168 --> 00:16:58.576 wasting our time building the archaeology. We might as well pitch 3000 00:16:58.609 --> 00:17:04.305 tents and have a, have a community straight away. Um So it seems to me 00:17:04.338 --> 00:17:07.535 that we got to get the building built before we can start this big 00:17:07.568 --> 00:17:11.607 experiment. The building of Arcosanti is a dynamic process. Mistakes are 00:17:11.640 --> 00:17:15.887 made and learned from there are disagreements, these are being worked 00:17:15.920 --> 00:17:20.645 through. Next, Paulo talks about this in the sense that what he refers to 00:17:20.678 --> 00:17:25.305 as being stuck is the same as having problems in order to be able to 00:17:25.338 --> 00:17:29.196 operate, you are stuck with something. In fact, we are stuck with gravity 00:17:29.229 --> 00:17:33.956 and friction so that we can do something. We are stuck with the desert, 00:17:33.989 --> 00:17:37.107 but it's just because we are stuck with it that we can do something. So 00:17:37.140 --> 00:17:39.607 you always have to get stuck with something in order to be able to 00:17:39.640 --> 00:17:43.857 transcend this something, you are stuck with your body. And luckily you 00:17:43.890 --> 00:17:46.156 are stuck with your body because if you didn't have the body to be stuck 00:17:46.189 --> 00:17:52.387 with, you wouldn't exist. So we, we should not have this pitfall of saying 00:17:52.420 --> 00:17:56.156 that we should not be tied to anything because by tying ourselves to 00:17:56.189 --> 00:18:00.647 something we are, we are stuck with it. That's the only way you exist. One 00:18:00.680 --> 00:18:07.766 must be. And B means being touched. One of my skepticism about some of the 00:18:07.799 --> 00:18:12.285 ideas in architectural school is this hatred almost about the 00:18:12.318 --> 00:18:16.776 objectification of whatever we are thinking of. Sooner or later. You are 00:18:16.809 --> 00:18:20.736 yet to objectify. You have to come up with the, with the hardware. 00:18:20.769 --> 00:18:23.906 Otherwise you keep planning, you keep designing, you keep thinking, you 00:18:23.939 --> 00:18:28.226 keep debating, you keep demolishing, you keep uh but you don't, you're 00:18:28.259 --> 00:18:32.805 unstuck. I asked Soleri whether there was any possibility of his losing 00:18:32.838 --> 00:18:37.006 control of the project. It's always a possibility. There are two things 00:18:37.039 --> 00:18:41.045 which are somehow controlling it. One is that I have veto power for the 00:18:41.078 --> 00:18:46.736 moment. So that means that legally no one has the authority of kicking me 00:18:46.769 --> 00:18:52.107 out. Also for the moment, the trustees are myself and my wife. And one 00:18:52.140 --> 00:18:55.756 reason was to keep it this way was because I want to be sure that I could 00:18:55.789 --> 00:19:03.045 have that control. The only is that uh even even if uh let's say a group 00:19:03.078 --> 00:19:08.006 could kick me out once I am out, probably this thing without my approval, 00:19:08.039 --> 00:19:13.147 this thing may die unless I, I still work from outside in trying to help 00:19:13.180 --> 00:19:17.217 him. Because for the moment, I think people are coming here fundamentally 00:19:17.250 --> 00:19:22.676 because I'm, I'm the head of the, of the process might be an illusion. But 00:19:22.709 --> 00:19:28.026 I think more or less it's true. At the same time, I think there is enough 00:19:28.059 --> 00:19:30.967 loyalty. 00:19:31.000 --> 00:19:35.847 Well, it's quite loyalty to me. An idea among the, the assistant to 00:19:35.880 --> 00:19:40.357 believe on my part that this for the moment is not, uh is not a 00:19:40.390 --> 00:19:43.026 possibility. 00:19:43.059 --> 00:19:46.746 It's even if you're no longer here. Well, if I'm no longer here, is there 00:19:46.779 --> 00:19:50.127 anything else? Once, 00:19:50.160 --> 00:19:56.607 once somebody is not there things happen without this, somebody, it's no 00:19:56.640 --> 00:20:01.166 matter how much you might try to plan the future in case or when you are 00:20:01.199 --> 00:20:07.916 not here in those plans are, are in a way illegitimate or, or they impose 00:20:07.949 --> 00:20:12.285 coercion that I don't think are likely 00:20:12.318 --> 00:20:18.686 anybody, any, any dead person has the right to po not leaving person. 00:20:18.719 --> 00:20:22.496 How can I tell you that when I'm there that you're going to do this 00:20:22.529 --> 00:20:26.795 instead of that? I can ask you when I'm alive to put you through this or 00:20:26.828 --> 00:20:31.467 that because I can try to explain to you. And I, I'm part of the process. 00:20:31.500 --> 00:20:35.637 Evidently, the value of the idea has to, has to be there without the 00:20:35.670 --> 00:20:40.055 presence, without my presence. So if my work has any meaning has to be 00:20:40.088 --> 00:20:45.335 self supporting, self convincing, to end the program. So, Leary talks 00:20:45.368 --> 00:20:49.906 about the significance of a or something. It is the the bridging element 00:20:49.939 --> 00:20:55.647 between what you might call mass energy and what you might call spirit. 00:20:55.680 --> 00:21:00.097 It's the bridge that it keeps being built by life every time it makes a 00:21:00.130 --> 00:21:08.130 little step. 00:21:16.709 --> 00:21:21.147 Arcosanti is located about 60 miles north of Phoenix. The site is one mile 00:21:21.180 --> 00:21:26.256 northeast of Coeds Junction which is on interstate 17 between Phoenix and 00:21:26.289 --> 00:21:32.075 Flagstaff at the Prescott turn off except during winter months. Our Kante 00:21:32.108 --> 00:21:39.117 is open to visitors. Tours are given at 11 a.m. and at 3 p.m. Kanti which 00:21:39.150 --> 00:21:42.397 is Soleri's headquarters and the site of his original experimental 00:21:42.430 --> 00:21:47.035 structures is located in Scottsdale. Visitors to Kanti can buy Soleri 00:21:47.068 --> 00:21:53.647 Bells there for information about our Kanti workshops contact Kanti which 00:21:53.680 --> 00:22:01.680 is spelled C OS A NT I. The address is 6433, Doubletree Road, Scottsdale 00:22:03.338 --> 00:22:07.335 Arizona 85253 00:22:07.368 --> 00:22:15.368 that is K Santi 6433, Doubletree Road, Scottsdale Arizona 85253. 00:22:25.449 --> 00:22:30.397 This program was narrated and produced by Frank Kroger at KPFK Pacifica 00:22:30.430 --> 00:22:36.328 Radio. In Los Angeles with technical assistance from Phil Mendelson.