Department.
Is that just a preview of what they're gonna run? Representative Giordano.
Can you hear me? This is Phyllis. Yes. How you doing? Welcome back again.
I'm doing fine. I just wanted to let you know, I don't know if you heard
that, but we were just practicing right there. That's what I thought. So,
we'll be coming with you. And, um, what is the status of the bill? Can you
tell me right now? I think, I think it was passed by the Senate Judiciary
Committee. It passed the house and I think it's finally been heard by the
Senate judiciary committee and passed, but I'm not sure about that frankly.
Ok, but it's still moving through the Senate, right? We can say that it's
in the Senate. Ok. Well, we'll be, uh, we'll be with you in about a minute
or so.
Good evening. Welcome to Horizon Michael Grant is off tonight. I'm Phyllis
Palaio. There are more prisoners in Arizona than there is room to house
them to make matters worse. The cost of housing convicts is skyrocketing.
So how are these problems going to be solved? One answer might lie in a
program called intensive probation supervision in a few minutes, we will
show you how it works and what impact it has had on the state's
corrections system. But first, it was a sad day for Phoenix police today.
Officer Kenneth Collings was buried. Collins was killed as he tried to
chase two bank robbers in Phoenix last Friday. However, before collins'
murder, lawmakers were discussing a measure dubbed the cop killer bill
with me to discuss House Bill. 2089 is Representative Gary Giordano.
Representative Giordano is a member of the House Judiciary Committee and
he represents district 24 in the Phoenix area before we speak with our
guest though we have this background report. It was a solemn day for the
Phoenix Police Department as one of its own was laid to rest.
Funeral services were held today for Officer Kenneth Collins. The eight
year veteran of the Phoenix police was gunned down last week as he tried
to stop two bank robbers in West Phoenix. Collins was working off duty as
a security guard for the bank. His loss was felt by hundreds of friends,
relatives and fellow police officers who crowded into ST Simon and Jude
Cathedral.
No greater gift. You k was spit and Polish and commanding presence.
He was strong in his beliefs. He had gentle in application.
He loved being a member of the Marine Corps. He loved being a Phoenix
police officer. He excelled in both. Ironically, Col's death came on the
very day, the Arizona legislature resolved to pass a measure allowing
judges to consider the death sentence for those people convicted of
murdering an officer of the peace. The death penalty would apply to cases
where the killer knew or would have had reason to believe the victim was
an officer of the law. Supporters of the so called cop killer Bill House
Bill 2089 say the murder of a police officer is one of the most heinous
crimes one can commit. But the new legislation may eventually lead to laws
requiring similar sentences for those that take the lives of civilians as
well. Representative Jim White is one of the sponsors of the bill. If
we're going to impose the death penalty for a person committing this kind
of crime, then it not apply to everyday citizens, store owners, business
people and, and anyone else, whatever the outcome in the legislature, it
may be too late to have an impact on this latest case of a local officer
killed in the line of duty. Representative Giardino. Can you tell us
specifically what the bill calls for the Bills lists as under the statutes
of aggravating circumstances. The fact that if someone who kills a police
officer or a law enforcement individual in the line of duty, that that can
be considered an aggravating circumstance for purposes of sentencing, the
bottom line of which would mean that the death penalty or life in prison
could be ordered by the judge. Are there any laws now regarding the
killing of police officers? There's none in this regard, obviously that
would stipulate that if you do take the life of a law enforcement police
officer in the line of duty, that you'd have the possibility of the death
sentence. Why does the legislature feel that a murder of a police officer
should be put in a special category? I think the feeling is certainly my
feeling would be as one of the sponsors of this bill that when we ask
people to put their lives on the line, when we ask them to be the first
line of defense against the criminal element in our society, that we need
to give them all the protection that we can, that in effect, they
represent us and that we consider it a very serious matter when they, when
someone out there would shoot or try to maim one of those police officers.
And I think it's indicative of our society if we send a message to the
criminal element that we will not tolerate shooting at a police officer
when he's performing his duties. But that raises the question is the life
of a police officer any more important than your life or my life or that
of someone's child. Well, there are those including myself who would think
that the death penalty should be extended in a number of areas, certainly
including any heinous or vicious crimes. I think some people would look
upon this bill as kind of the foot in the door to expand those areas where
the death penalty or life imprisonment should apply. I think on that basis
, it is worthy of support. But even if it wasn't again, I think that those
police officers, those law enforcement people who are out there protecting
the public from the criminal element need the kind of protection and the
signal that I think that this bill sends. Do you believe that this will
act as a deterrent to people who might consider or be in the situation of
killing a police officer? I think it should. I think there's been in the
past conflicting evidence from groups like the ac and others that perhaps
there is no deterrent, but I'm not sure that I agree with that. I think
the word can get around on the street pretty quickly that when someone is
in uniform and doing his duty as a peace officer that if you attempt to
cause any harm or maim him and you wind up killing him, that there are
dire consequences for that. I think for us not to do that sends certainly
the wrong signals to those people. But how much of a deterrent is it
really when you consider that no one really has been executed in this
state for years. That is a problem which hopefully with a different
mindset, at least with our judiciary could change. I think the people of
this state want to see in certain situations, I'm sure in this one and
again, in heinous crimes, that, that be an option that the court used that
we don't continue to allow people who are repetitive offenders and kill
individuals including police officers to just sit in jail at the
taxpayer's expense that if it is warranted, if they are repetitive, if
they've committed premeditated heinous crime, that the death penalty is a
viable option. And I think as a society, that's the kind of message we
need to send to these individuals. And the bill calls for either life
imprisonment or the death penalty under which circumstances would they be
sentenced to one or the other? I think under the present law, which again
, this is just amending to include the police officers. The discretion is
really up to the court. There is some binding language concerning the age
of the individual who commits the crime in so far as how long if it is
life in prison and how long of a time frame they'd have to serve before
there's a potential for parole. I think the minimum in all cases is 25
years.
But I think under this bill and under the present law, whenever the
aggravating circumstances are looked at it's up to the court to make those
decisions. One of the provisions of the bill mentions the fact that the
suspect knowing that the victim was a police officer. How does that read
the language I think was that the individual knew or had reason to know
that this was a police officer performing his duties. There was a bill
last year that was held in the Senate that just applied to peace officers.
But it didn't differentiate between those who are on duty or off duty.
And this is explicit in so far as applying only to someone whose life is
taken while he's performing his duties. What about undercover police
officers or detectives that are not readily identifiable as police? My
understanding of the language is that it would apply to them too. If the
individual knew or had reason to know that they were working, they were on
duty. And again, that's up to the courts to decide from hearing all the
evidence. Right? Representative Giordano, we thank you for joining us once
again on horizon. Thank you and still to come on horizon, a money saving
alternative for convicts headed for the state prison.
The Arizona Correctional system faces a conflict in priorities. On one
hand, it has to prepare for an inevitable rise in crime that will
naturally accompany a growing state. On the other hand, the process of
building and staffing new prisons is becoming prohibitively expensive with
projected costs ranging in the hundreds of millions of dollars. One way to
relieve the strain on the correctional system is by using intensive
probation supervision. This special program was developed three years ago
by the Arizona legislature and is administered by the Arizona Supreme
Court. The goal to divert serious but nonviolent offenders from an already
overcrowded prison system. When you think about the question of building
more prisons, consider these facts over the next five years. Arizona's
prisons will be bulging with another 4000 inmates that would put prisoner
numbers over the 11,000 mark equal to a small city about the size of a
patchy junction providing that space will cost $120 million an amount that
would be more than enough to cover four years tuition for every resident
student at Arizona State University. Add to that another $56 million a
year for the 2000 new prison employees needed to run them. And pretty soon
you are talking about big money. One way of avoiding financial disaster
while keeping the public safe is to allow certain non violent inmates to
remain at home. Under a program of intensive probation. Under the program
, both adult and juvenile offenders are subject to close supervision by
their probation officers. Juvenile intensive probation is a program which
is set up for your high risk kids.
It is a program that keeps them out of the Department of Corrections. It's
a program that will help the parent as well as the juvenile and it's a
benefit to the public to get a feel for the way IPs works. We were
permitted to interview a probation officer currently supervising a
juvenile with his mother present. All are residents of the city of Globe.
The officer Bill Stanton has been supervising Wayne for the past two
years. Wayne is 16. We asked him what the program has done for him. Well,
mostly for the good,
they really needed some direction.
I usually stay home anyway, but they tell me stay home unless you have
permission from your probation officer. But I usually stay home anyway.
But lots of times I have to ask my probation officer I can go to if I can
go to the show. Usually he says yes, but still have to ask him anyway. I
can't just go out and do whatever I want.
But other than that, it's been real nice. It hasn't really bothered me
that much when a juvenile is placed on intensive supervision by the court
, the probation officer will sit down with the family and with the
juvenile, we'll sit down and we'll explain the rules, what is expected of
them. What I expect them to do, I'll speak with them and ask them what
they expect of me as far as I'm concerned. It's a two way street, you can
tell the family and the kids what you want them to do. But if you don't
give them some feedback and let them know what you were there for, to help
what you're there to help them or what you're going to give them, then
you're not going to get too much cooperation while being supervised. Isn't
fun for Wayne. It's better than the alternative.
Yes. Getting him help was difficult. But on the road now, to him getting
better, it's,
it's really nice. Now, I don't have to be afraid that he's going to be
shipped off somewhere. Yeah, much better. I'd rather have bill coming over
to my house every night than having a guard come around my cell every day.
Joining me this evening is Dan Prince. Dan is a specialist in probation
programs for the Arizona Supreme Court and he'll shed some more light on
this fairly new program and the impact it has had on criminals and on the
correction system. Welcome to Horizon Dan. Glad to be here. Now, we just
saw a little bit about the juvenile intensive probation program. There is
an adult probation program as well. How long have both of these been in
effect? The adult program was instituted in 1985 July of 1985. So we're
coming up to three years and the Juvenile intensive Probation program was
begun in January of 1987. What brought these both about? Well, the
legislature I believe was reacting to a lot of feelings on the part of the
citizenry that there needed to be some tougher consequences for young
people involved in serious offenses. But at the same time, they recognized
the need to reduce the bed space at an already overcrowded department of
Corrections, freeing up for more serious offenders. The truly dangerous
and violent offenders. Now, how does the juvenile intensive probation
program differ from the adult program in the juvenile intensive probation
program? We're dealing with young people naturally under the age of 18.
And there are more factors to consider relative to other individuals that
impact a juvenile's life. Teachers at school, family members, parents
treatment agencies. In the adult program, there is more emphasis on
dealing directly with the offender rather than other individuals who may
impact significantly on a juvenile. Now, who is eligible within both of
these in the adult program. Probation eligible class 45 and six offenders
, which are, these are the less dangerous offenders, those convicted of
offenses that don't involve personal injury or use of weapons. They are
the prime, they make up the prime candidate for the program and the
juvenile intensive probation program. We're looking at young people who
would otherwise be committed to the Department of Corrections if it wasn't
for this program and they generally have a history of at least three prior
referrals within the year. Specifically. How does it work? What
restrictions, what limitations do they face? Where are they located during
this time? In the juvenile program? Young people placed under juvenile
intensive supervision must to complete a 32 hour week, perform community
service, attend school regularly without missing any classes work or be
involved in a program of court order treatment, for instance, drug and
alcohol rehabilitation if they have a substance abuse problem. Now, what
about anything they choose to do aside from that, if they meet all of that
criteria, are they free to go out and do other activities? Not necessarily
, the program is predicated on the notion that young people will remain at
home in the company of their parents unless specific permission is granted
in each instance by the supervising probation officer, essentially, it's
house arrest and the adult program is similar as well. But might that be
granted if the juvenile wanted to go somewhere? A special event, a prom at
school, whatever they might be interested in, would that be something
that's likely granted to someone on intensive probation? It would
depending on how well they've progressed in the program. If they've made
good progress in school, if they have observed all the conditions of
probation, then the probation officer may determine that they may attend a
special event. Yes. What has been the rate of success so far in the
program? In the juvenile program? We're looking at a success rate close to
80%. In other words, 20% of the young people involved in the program have
been brought back before the sentencing judge, juvenile court, judge and
sent to the Department of Correction. Their probation has been violated
are juveniles though really responsible enough to work. Well, in this type
of a program, we think they are. We also think that by having the
probation officer more actively involved in the supervision as opposed to
traditional probation where a young person might come in and see a p once
a month in the office by having the po go out into the community into the
home, a much more intrusive form of probation. They get more involved in
that young person's life. They become a significant other to that
individual. And we feel that that relationship is really the crux of the
success of the program. The taped report that we saw prior to starting the
interview mentioned a cost savings to the public. What kind of a cost
savings are we talking about? The best estimate suggests that it costs in
the neighborhood of $25,000 a year to house a young person at the
Department of Corrections in this program, our approximate costs are
running less than $5000 per year per probationer aside from financial, are
there any other benefits to the to the community? I feel that there are
significant benefits Phyllis. I think that number one, these young people
are performing valuable community service. They're involved in clean up
operations and parks and streets. They also are remaining in school and
hopefully getting an education and becoming useful citizens. Young people
are our future and the program really recognizes that and stresses the
importance of education. What do you say to critics who say that this is
just kind of easy time for a kid who might otherwise be put in jail and
behind bars. What I would say is having a probation officer come into my
home at midnight or possibly another late hour of the evening interrupt my
family ask me to submit to a drug or urine test, search my property if
necessary without probable cause. Just by virtue of being in the program
is really not a cakewalk. I consider that to be rather stringent is the
purpose of it though, for punishment or for rehabilitation? And is that
done better in the house arrest type of situation versus a locked up? We
strive to achieve a balance between control on the one hand and
rehabilitation on the other, the same probation officer who may be
demanding a drug test of that young person or coming over at a late hour
to make sure that he or she is where they're supposed to be, might turn
around the next day and involve that young person in a therapeutic
counseling session or take them to a ball game. We really try to meet the
child's needs in a balanced type of approach briefly. Do you see this as
something that will be expanded in the future? Hopefully, we will be
expanding a number of counties have indicated to us that their success
with the program has been good and they're looking to bring on new
officers. Ok. Well, Dan Prince, we thank you for joining us. Pleasure
being here. I appreciate the opportunity coming up next. We'll show you
the second love of one of Arizona's celebrated architects.
There's nothing like the sound from a wind bell. It has a calming effect
while reminding you of nature's energy. Here in Arizona, there's an artist
known for his Wind Bells. His name is Paolo Soleri. While you may know of
his success as an architect in building Arcos Sante, an energy efficient
city north of Phoenix. Others around the world recognize his talent for
making bows.
These are the Wind Bells of Palo Soleri. They were first created in the
1950 s under a unique circumstance. Soleri at the time was selling clay
pots like this one in Santa Fe, New Mexico. When a bell designer's death
opened a new door for him. He was making Korean wind bells, ceramics,
traditional Korean wind bells and he had some outlets in Santa Fe. But one
or two months before we moved in Santa Fe, he died in a car accident. So
there were those shops that were looking for someone to carry on with the
bells. So they asked us and after thinking a little bit said, well, maybe
we can come up with some ideas, some designs, our designs. So that's what
we did today. Soleri still makes ceramic wind bells, but it's the bronze
bells that are in demand here at the Caste Foundry in Scottsdale, 100
bells a day are produced. Many are shipped around the world. A lot of care
goes into making a Solari bell. The process. As you'll see is quite simple.
Casters begin with an aluminum pattern designed by Soleri. The pattern is
placed in a molding box which is then packed with sand.
Once the sand is compressed, the aluminum pattern is removed and finishing
touches are applied to the sand mold. The bell first receives the Soleri
stamp and then it's decorated with lines and patterns. Next. The sand mold
is prepared for the bronze which is heated to 2500 F. Before pouring
bronze is an ideal medal for bell making. Says Hannis Garrett, the foreman
of the coati foundry. It always will ring. We've tried brass. They used to
pour in brass, but you couldn't get a precise bell and the ringing quality
with the that we use. Now you'll always have a bell that rings after 20
minutes, the sand is removed and a bronze Soleri bell is revealed. But an
important process still remains. Once the bell is assembled for hanging,
it's placed in an acid bath. This gives the bell its patina or finish. The
bells are then sprayed with water and covered with burlap as the bell
dries. It's up to where it was laying, how the burlap was touching it, how
wet or dry it was and how the atmospheric conditions as to how it dries.
And that decides the coloring on the bells and I haven't seemed to alike.
That's what makes the Soleri favorite. Each one has personality. Some
even have a cause Soleri recently began making cause bells. This one
represents the arts in Arizona and the message of this one is Save the
Whales. When a Cause Bell is purchased, a percentage goes to charitable
organizations. So far, an estimated $46,000 has been donated. The bells
are very special to Solari but they've never been his primary interest as
an architect. His first love is Arcosanti. His city of the future in Mayor
Arizona. The bells were a way by which I could do some hand work, which I
always like to do and also a financial resource so I could do the work in
architecture that I wanted to do
tomorrow on Horizon commentator Bob Robb will share his thoughts on
Governor Mofford and the job she's doing so far and don't forget live
gavel to gavel coverage of the State of Arizona versus Evan and Willard B.
Meacham trial begins tomorrow morning here on channel eight coverage
starts at 9 30. That's our show this evening. Glad you could be here with
us. I'm Phyllis Palacio. Good night.
Yeah.
If you have comments regarding this evening's Horizon program, send them
to Horizon Channel eight television, Arizona State University. 10 P 85287.