WEBVTT 00:00:03.310 --> 00:00:05.310 The times of the civilizations that went into the desert. 00:00:09.730 --> 00:00:15.797 So if it costs the story for the morning look at there was 6000 years and 00:00:15.830 --> 00:00:19.576 its value 00:00:19.609 --> 00:00:24.736 problem seems to me that again, because the 6000 years is exactly it's 00:00:24.769 --> 00:00:30.576 nothing but that. But that doesn't mean that we since we're social in 00:00:30.609 --> 00:00:36.506 existence a riddle. No question is that if the process can be carried on, 00:00:36.539 --> 00:00:39.567 then all these things are going to become very relevant and they're going 00:00:39.600 --> 00:00:43.097 to explain themselves and they're going to have a very specific clear 00:00:43.130 --> 00:00:50.406 niche by which they see themselves as part of this process. Maybe I 00:00:50.439 --> 00:00:52.807 remember attribution. 00:00:52.840 --> 00:00:57.387 Mm hmm. I think you're very proud. I think we're a long way in the future. 00:00:57.420 --> 00:01:02.537 We will get I think this particular center in the next one will be a very 00:01:02.570 --> 00:01:07.406 they were trying as I accept a long way in the future, but that I don't 00:01:07.439 --> 00:01:12.107 find this car. Yeah. But after all, it's not going to happen. We don't 00:01:12.140 --> 00:01:16.326 know what's going to happen because the little Bieber I couldn't believe 00:01:16.359 --> 00:01:20.926 that this is where he would have an evidence. It's a there was an 00:01:20.959 --> 00:01:25.857 incapacity double creature to imagine that something more than its own 00:01:25.890 --> 00:01:31.926 reality would ever exist. So we should never realize them to be humble 00:01:31.959 --> 00:01:36.656 enough to realize that as your neighbors of today, we cannot really 00:01:36.689 --> 00:01:43.236 pretend to know that that's a pie in the sky since we we better perhaps 00:01:43.269 --> 00:01:47.286 have a different fate. My metaphor, but the result of a class in which had 00:01:47.319 --> 00:01:53.897 failed in itself. I think the last 6000 years are not that significant. I 00:01:53.930 --> 00:02:01.837 think particularly if we take our venture seriously because we are here to 00:02:01.870 --> 00:02:06.467 build and perfect yet another container, yet another instrument through 00:02:06.500 --> 00:02:11.346 which we think human spirit will be nurtured and developed. And if so the 00:02:11.379 --> 00:02:17.106 last 6000 years are immensely important for it is taking two of them that 00:02:17.139 --> 00:02:24.557 we look at ourselves for it is during the last 68, 10,000 years, 6000 00:02:24.590 --> 00:02:27.747 years that civilizations have been nurtured and developing in the cities. 00:02:27.780 --> 00:02:35.626 And therefore infer our metaphor is that history is Evolution of matter 00:02:35.659 --> 00:02:40.186 from matter to super matter by appropriate instruments. Those instruments 00:02:40.219 --> 00:02:46.077 during the last 6000 years were cities. And if these 6000 years are not so 00:02:46.110 --> 00:02:49.066 important venture maybe not important. And since our adventure is 00:02:49.099 --> 00:02:52.717 important, therefore, I conclude that the addition ones that is like the 00:02:52.750 --> 00:02:59.066 last 6020 years. Very important. I it's not a matter of not being 00:02:59.099 --> 00:03:03.617 important. I think I think that's probably an extreme statement that it's 00:03:03.650 --> 00:03:08.807 not important. The thing is that you see the it's hard to be in the middle 00:03:08.840 --> 00:03:13.606 of a system and see where it's going. And that's what we are. It's hard 00:03:13.639 --> 00:03:17.756 for us to know that right now we're orbiting in three different directions 00:03:17.789 --> 00:03:21.006 and we've recently discovered that the whole Milky Way Galaxy is moving at 00:03:21.039 --> 00:03:24.666 a million miles an hour in some direction besides all the other officer 00:03:24.699 --> 00:03:28.886 and we sit here and we feel very stable because we don't see all that 00:03:28.919 --> 00:03:36.919 because 00:03:40.039 --> 00:03:44.777 because 00:03:44.810 --> 00:03:48.807 consciousness is a divine attribute 00:03:48.840 --> 00:03:54.277 and be aware that perfection. But it's it's really not. Then then I'm 00:03:54.310 --> 00:03:58.897 asking myself why do I have the right to be consciousness? And that cliff 00:03:58.930 --> 00:04:04.006 doesn't have to be conscious. So eventually 00:04:04.039 --> 00:04:10.777 consciousness has to be, there's an ethical basis. Again, it's justice and 00:04:10.810 --> 00:04:17.777 it's justice in terms of the ultimate super condition which was just 00:04:17.810 --> 00:04:19.916 symphony 00:04:19.949 --> 00:04:26.337 because symphony is anticipating. The anticipation is a practical of this 00:04:26.370 --> 00:04:33.827 community which makes technology as well. But 00:04:33.860 --> 00:04:39.906 the chinese technology of the creature called the technologies of the 00:04:39.939 --> 00:04:43.236 instrumentation, which pathology 00:04:43.269 --> 00:04:47.106 also also 00:04:47.139 --> 00:04:53.647 really I mean this is where to cover everything I did what we do with this 00:04:53.680 --> 00:04:58.616 technology a physiologist. Technology to 00:04:58.649 --> 00:05:05.457 my my logician again is in his protesting. If we have determined it is 00:05:05.490 --> 00:05:10.156 such a large area that it covers everything, it is probably empty of 00:05:10.189 --> 00:05:18.189 meaning. 00:05:22.540 --> 00:05:27.967 It is something that goes through me which takes care of all the processes 00:05:28.000 --> 00:05:32.757 that need to be taken care of and of which I am not aware. It's a 00:05:32.790 --> 00:05:40.790 technology of the flesh. 00:05:43.279 --> 00:05:47.837 Technology, I'm sorry, it's my technology 00:05:47.870 --> 00:05:55.870 twisting my semantic 00:05:58.199 --> 00:06:05.707 because he is not and because the demand would not create the perfect. 00:06:05.740 --> 00:06:09.937 That's right. But yet later who said that. Well, first of all, each 00:06:09.970 --> 00:06:16.486 moment has to be a divinity and kind consciousness and divine attitude and 00:06:16.519 --> 00:06:21.406 that they do. We are saying about the southeast and the airport, we must 00:06:21.439 --> 00:06:29.439 have some divinity training and Mhm. 00:06:33.240 --> 00:06:36.806 That's alright, 00:06:36.839 --> 00:06:40.926 perfection, 00:06:40.959 --> 00:06:48.959 perfection. My my response is that motion is a beautiful invention. What 00:06:49.740 --> 00:06:57.027 we have to be tangible. 00:06:57.060 --> 00:06:59.226 Congratulations 00:06:59.259 --> 00:07:06.296 to reach up stamps to develop itself into a grown up full fledged divines 00:07:06.329 --> 00:07:12.226 of. So there's no contradiction. The condition is believing it is a very 00:07:12.259 --> 00:07:19.606 broad creature that has the need of making ambulances all to itself. 00:07:19.639 --> 00:07:22.606 Yeah, 00:07:22.639 --> 00:07:26.767 thank 00:07:26.800 --> 00:07:33.806 you. 00:07:33.839 --> 00:07:41.839 Yeah. 00:07:43.040 --> 00:07:45.017 You 00:07:45.050 --> 00:07:50.017 know he asked me a question and then we got into a discussion about some 00:07:50.050 --> 00:07:54.647 of the things that dr Bruce asked. But he mentioned the thing about now 00:07:54.680 --> 00:07:59.137 that we have all this great technology and so on. All this information 00:07:59.170 --> 00:08:04.087 stacked around. We have nothing to say. And I wanted to make a small 00:08:04.120 --> 00:08:08.806 comment on that point of view. 00:08:08.839 --> 00:08:14.507 We we certainly have a lot to say and what we have to say is that 00:08:14.540 --> 00:08:21.156 evolving around us is something that we are all becoming aware of. And as 00:08:21.189 --> 00:08:25.246 we become aware of it, we participate in it. And what is it? Well, it's 00:08:25.279 --> 00:08:29.726 the fact that there is a better kind of an existence for the kind of 00:08:29.759 --> 00:08:34.087 uneven as we are or something we evidently have some kind of awareness. 00:08:34.120 --> 00:08:38.687 Maybe it's just ability kind of thing or something that it is possible 00:08:38.720 --> 00:08:44.016 that there is something beyond where we are that we could participate in. 00:08:44.049 --> 00:08:47.827 That would be better. You know that might be a little more fulfilling or 00:08:47.860 --> 00:08:52.506 something. I think that's what motivates a lot of us. That's why we create 00:08:52.539 --> 00:08:55.626 environments and things. Otherwise, what's the alternative, the 00:08:55.659 --> 00:08:59.287 alternative is to say there isn't anything. And so if there isn't anything 00:08:59.320 --> 00:09:07.087 , why bother? Why don't we lay down our tools and not playing much the 00:09:07.120 --> 00:09:11.476 influence of future? We have to have a commitment and I think ingrained in 00:09:11.509 --> 00:09:16.467 us as some kind of a commitment. So one of the tools we have to gather 00:09:16.500 --> 00:09:21.396 data is the computer and the computer with a computer. We've taken all 00:09:21.429 --> 00:09:25.797 this information dr Bruce talked about and it's been almost irrelevant. 00:09:25.830 --> 00:09:30.557 It's just information that information is useless. But gradually, if you 00:09:30.590 --> 00:09:35.167 can take information and make it available in different arrays, if you can 00:09:35.200 --> 00:09:41.766 take all the possibilities that may exist that affect a particular action 00:09:41.799 --> 00:09:47.797 , you can start doing things with information that is creative. And 00:09:47.830 --> 00:09:51.687 certainly now that is one of the things that technology, one of the things 00:09:51.720 --> 00:09:58.106 that modern computerization can do and it's taking information and 00:09:58.139 --> 00:10:03.726 presenting it to us and doing it for us and giving us then the freedom and 00:10:03.759 --> 00:10:07.636 the opportunity to be creative with it. We used to be so busy accumulating 00:10:07.669 --> 00:10:11.246 the darn stuff, you know, that we were exhausted by the time we got to 00:10:11.279 --> 00:10:16.157 accumulate and had no time to use our creative powers to try and force it 00:10:16.190 --> 00:10:20.026 together into a synthesis and that the computer is doing all of the 00:10:20.059 --> 00:10:23.577 tedious calculations for us now in our Children go to school. They want to 00:10:23.610 --> 00:10:27.407 learn. They don't have to add things anymore. They can push a little 00:10:27.440 --> 00:10:33.606 pocket computer and get their answers so on. And so quickly we do have 00:10:33.639 --> 00:10:39.116 available something we can do the tedious kind of routine sort of in the 00:10:39.149 --> 00:10:46.526 past human kinds of actions. Mhm. For us to free us to present to us 00:10:46.559 --> 00:10:51.276 information and allow us to use that information freely and creatively in 00:10:51.309 --> 00:10:55.126 terms of moving ourselves ahead to something that's higher synthesis and a 00:10:55.159 --> 00:10:58.467 little more fulfilling than what we have today. So because I talk because 00:10:58.500 --> 00:11:03.547 I'm an advocate of technology because I'm in it and so I feel I feel like 00:11:03.580 --> 00:11:07.246 followed us do that. You know, maybe maybe computers is a mutation and 00:11:07.279 --> 00:11:11.407 maybe that mutation will die through the process of evolution and time 00:11:11.440 --> 00:11:16.957 will tell. It may very well be that nature evolution is very inefficient 00:11:16.990 --> 00:11:21.616 sometimes. And some mutations just absolutely don't work out. Maybe the 00:11:21.649 --> 00:11:25.756 computers of dinosaur And maybe give or take another 100 or 200 years. 00:11:25.789 --> 00:11:30.327 People look back and say wow, what a nightmare. That was maybe not. The 00:11:30.360 --> 00:11:34.187 only room we find that out is to work it through and give it a chance. 00:11:34.220 --> 00:11:38.667 Watch it through time. See if it does become a valuable tool. It may or 00:11:38.700 --> 00:11:43.307 may not. That's the way it goes. 00:11:43.340 --> 00:11:49.106 Yeah. 00:11:49.139 --> 00:11:51.506 Mm hmm. 00:11:51.539 --> 00:11:59.539 More and more benefit supplying the society. These things have a heart 00:11:59.940 --> 00:12:02.407 technology 00:12:02.440 --> 00:12:08.106 society false news, creating more focus 00:12:08.139 --> 00:12:13.407 going on this play. And I would like to hear Henry. They are related. Well 00:12:13.440 --> 00:12:18.506 , moment. Okay, 00:12:18.539 --> 00:12:25.067 Celtics praise for a moment. Mhm We'll have to be careful when it tries to 00:12:25.100 --> 00:12:31.846 represent other people I think. And representative means mm shovel of our 00:12:31.879 --> 00:12:36.626 existence. So for another open kind of third world nations, I'll probably 00:12:36.659 --> 00:12:43.577 don't have it myself. True. I think that there is a great deal of 00:12:43.610 --> 00:12:47.827 ambiguity and confusion among Third World nations for they are all 00:12:47.860 --> 00:12:52.126 mesmerized by the power of our budget. And this is the condition of all 00:12:52.159 --> 00:12:57.226 human beings in this world. Somehow our propaganda. The images we have 00:12:57.259 --> 00:13:01.846 predicted are so powerful that even if they have best reasons to somehow 00:13:01.879 --> 00:13:07.106 resist our goodies, they are irresistibly drawn to them. And this is 00:13:07.139 --> 00:13:13.006 something that is that defies logic. I just proposition number one, 00:13:13.039 --> 00:13:18.457 Proposition # two which really is colonnades with the first one that it is 00:13:18.490 --> 00:13:23.457 not only adults but Children who are already influenced by our conception 00:13:23.490 --> 00:13:29.976 of Life, wealth and technology for it seems that even among 3rd world 00:13:30.009 --> 00:13:34.766 nations were uh information technology has reached them. They have tv and 00:13:34.799 --> 00:13:39.276 other things when kids are asked to draw their home their house, 00:13:39.309 --> 00:13:43.567 invariably they come up for the kind of Colombian filled with two car 00:13:43.600 --> 00:13:49.307 cultures. It is really incredible taking into account their culture. Well 00:13:49.340 --> 00:13:55.177 , I think that the answer very much depend on who you talk to. I think 00:13:55.210 --> 00:14:01.417 people who have done best in africa particularly are the Tanzanians And 00:14:01.450 --> 00:14:04.907 they tried various, they started first accepting everything that we have 00:14:04.940 --> 00:14:10.986 offered them, starting with medicine, high power medicine uh consultant 00:14:11.019 --> 00:14:16.587 specialists. And they found that the main hospital was devouring 90-95% of 00:14:16.620 --> 00:14:23.266 their resources, of the medical resources Of 95% of the financial 00:14:23.299 --> 00:14:27.937 resources for medicine. And then found that only 3% of people I could use 00:14:27.970 --> 00:14:35.246 it. So they really change the media now. They have gone very much along 00:14:35.279 --> 00:14:42.067 chinese lines. Uh small units in every village than bigger units in 00:14:42.100 --> 00:14:46.207 districts And still bigger units in bigger districts and one simple 00:14:46.240 --> 00:14:52.496 hospital. I mean just uh case medical care is really available to help us 00:14:52.529 --> 00:14:57.746 everybody and I would have to talk for quite a while in order to show how 00:14:57.779 --> 00:15:02.366 in spite of the fact that they're uh personally is not right for they take 00:15:02.399 --> 00:15:08.596 often people with fifth or sixth grade education between the age of 14 and 00:15:08.629 --> 00:15:15.207 16 and for four years, they really 00:15:15.240 --> 00:15:21.067 conditioned them to a very narrow way of recognizing certain diseases And 00:15:21.100 --> 00:15:25.187 they become very expert at recognizing certain from the diseases. All the 00:15:25.220 --> 00:15:31.496 the medical knowledge is very small as the result they can recognize most 00:15:31.529 --> 00:15:36.287 current diseases in about 5-7 minutes. While it takes well trained doctors 00:15:36.320 --> 00:15:40.207 12-14 minutes. 00:15:40.240 --> 00:15:43.526 But there is another reason they are not well trained and therefore they 00:15:43.559 --> 00:15:48.856 do not have high aspirations beyond what they accomplished. So the basic 00:15:48.889 --> 00:15:51.356 education is 00:15:51.389 --> 00:15:55.096 you may say. And then on the top of it specialization and they are very 00:15:55.129 --> 00:15:59.807 happy to be of use is really turning tables altogether. And recently they 00:15:59.840 --> 00:16:04.057 have done it with their education. They have found it following what was 00:16:04.090 --> 00:16:08.596 best in education. They have been training their people to do very 00:16:08.629 --> 00:16:13.486 abstract, very specialized tasks which are of little use for their country. 00:16:13.519 --> 00:16:18.947 And then they went back to combine work education with work. And then 00:16:18.980 --> 00:16:23.896 finally they have tried to recreate they're old cultural pattern by 00:16:23.929 --> 00:16:28.646 introducing ritual dancing, singing as a part of education as a part of 00:16:28.679 --> 00:16:33.207 total upbringing. And in this way I think implicitly required departed 00:16:33.240 --> 00:16:36.606 with the most specialized with most sophisticated goodies we can provide 00:16:36.639 --> 00:16:41.526 them with. Is he? I think that history will tell us which departures are 00:16:41.559 --> 00:16:44.927 correct. But just thinking about the computer. I was asking myself. All 00:16:44.960 --> 00:16:49.366 right, given all the resources all the time. I have a number of other 00:16:49.399 --> 00:16:52.766 people have let us try to make computer the most compassionate the most 00:16:52.799 --> 00:16:58.506 humanistic instrument we want to make of it. How would we go about it? 00:16:58.539 --> 00:17:03.776 We'll probably go by trying to read my new functions for it. Trying to 00:17:03.809 --> 00:17:09.526 find our most precious assets in thinking most difficult problems in 00:17:09.559 --> 00:17:14.076 solving and probably will try to redesign the whole beast according to 00:17:14.109 --> 00:17:19.617 different clients because it will not economic uh arithmetic operation 00:17:19.650 --> 00:17:23.597 that will be of importance. But there's more analysis tasks and as a 00:17:23.630 --> 00:17:26.397 result, we may have come up with something quite different than the 00:17:26.430 --> 00:17:30.986 computer reflecting our values and their goals. And consequently I still 00:17:31.019 --> 00:17:36.197 insist that there is a certain value scared building the computers the 00:17:36.230 --> 00:17:40.697 value of the quantitative world, the value of yes, no answers. The value 00:17:40.730 --> 00:17:45.617 of those things that make efficiency great in industry and make our 00:17:45.650 --> 00:17:51.427 quantitative economics work. But those other values have not been proven 00:17:51.460 --> 00:17:57.607 particularly if you take the last 10 years and the promises 00:17:57.640 --> 00:18:01.486 dutch for computers, they were both going to be the greatest chess 00:18:01.519 --> 00:18:05.996 channels. We're going to talk to us better than Shakespeare. We're going 00:18:06.029 --> 00:18:11.796 to acquire linguistic capability. I think that those more subtle task 00:18:11.829 --> 00:18:17.167 already now off the agenda, the promise has not been fulfilled those 00:18:17.200 --> 00:18:24.246 things that would make them more interesting as a human analog. And 00:18:24.279 --> 00:18:28.847 consequently if I were about designing the task for them, I might have uh 00:18:28.880 --> 00:18:33.197 ended up with altogether different instrument so different that the 00:18:33.230 --> 00:18:37.847 computer might not apply. And this would be creating new technology not by 00:18:37.880 --> 00:18:41.976 trying to infuse New course two existing technology by trying to create 00:18:42.009 --> 00:18:45.857 new technology according to new goals and values. And I think that if the 00:18:45.890 --> 00:18:53.506 Third World nations for little, they might have operated on this option. 00:18:53.539 --> 00:18:58.056 My answer is already long gone now. But what is happening in third world 00:18:58.089 --> 00:19:02.766 nations is the realization that some of the newest implement that we 00:19:02.799 --> 00:19:06.566 brought to them have catastrophic results. For example, the introduction 00:19:06.599 --> 00:19:12.566 of our class and other devices and consequently in order to progress, they 00:19:12.599 --> 00:19:18.467 go back by by reinventing a medieval tools which brings them back to to a 00:19:18.500 --> 00:19:22.806 certain wholeness of their ecological habitats and enables them to evolve 00:19:22.839 --> 00:19:27.796 in any way by respecting what is immediately given to them and going with 00:19:27.829 --> 00:19:32.736 nature, not against it. You're playing all the right time, you know, which 00:19:32.769 --> 00:19:37.687 evidently is very essential. But you're not talking. Yeah. You're really 00:19:37.720 --> 00:19:41.207 rejecting technology. You're saying that technology is to be appropriate 00:19:41.240 --> 00:19:46.006 naturally. Technology nobody can inject that everything has to be public, 00:19:46.039 --> 00:19:52.066 even a monster with a appropriateness. Yes, I think do I follow you 00:19:52.099 --> 00:19:56.006 through the computer thing after a point and I agree with you. But then 00:19:56.039 --> 00:19:59.816 they said that the computer is failing the commissioner thing is just 00:19:59.849 --> 00:20:05.736 developing. I think in terms of predictions made some 15 years ago, at 00:20:05.769 --> 00:20:10.857 this at this age time the computers will do this and that quite confident 00:20:10.890 --> 00:20:18.496 and arrogant predictions 00:20:18.529 --> 00:20:23.296 will become but that doesn't mean the computer which is not just a piece 00:20:23.329 --> 00:20:29.627 of machinery that you and I that we are compassionate by definition of 00:20:29.660 --> 00:20:35.226 arrogant by definition. We are disappointing. No, but there's evidence 00:20:35.259 --> 00:20:38.556 that it 00:20:38.589 --> 00:20:43.967 is. It's less than that, you know, it's been blue more like 20 years that 00:20:44.000 --> 00:20:50.167 people have been using computers at what at that time, the use of it's in 00:20:50.200 --> 00:20:54.536 its infancy really. The use of computers is in its infancy. And we're 00:20:54.569 --> 00:20:57.836 certainly evolving right now to where we can address computers with the 00:20:57.869 --> 00:21:01.357 human voice for example and maybe do some of the things you're talking 00:21:01.390 --> 00:21:06.197 about. But I'm not searching for anything in the computer world. I don't 00:21:06.230 --> 00:21:10.447 think anybody is with the tools of mankind to take over and do for us our 00:21:10.480 --> 00:21:14.367 creative thinking. There's absolutely no attempt to do that. It's quite 00:21:14.400 --> 00:21:18.496 the contrary. It's to provide us with tools just as we have tools here 00:21:18.529 --> 00:21:23.756 today to make it make it more optimum for us to do creative thinking. Well 00:21:23.789 --> 00:21:27.887 , I'm delighted with this new modest approach and Reprisal of computers, 00:21:27.920 --> 00:21:33.296 capacity in handling it all for there was about 10 years ago, six years 00:21:33.329 --> 00:21:38.336 ago and inferior that sure there was precisely and consequently you can 00:21:38.369 --> 00:21:43.236 really pick up statements and they showed you that in 2030. Yes, I'm 00:21:43.269 --> 00:21:48.546 totally dispensable. That's not the fault of all the computers people. I 00:21:48.579 --> 00:21:52.897 think I'm making a very interesting point. The presumption was based on 00:21:52.930 --> 00:21:57.107 the anticipation of certain capacity of the tool and then we found the 00:21:57.140 --> 00:22:02.476 capacity of the tool was lacking and consequently it was perhaps not the 00:22:02.509 --> 00:22:07.347 arrogance of the people but lack of realization that instrument was not 00:22:07.380 --> 00:22:11.687 made for certain purposes with which it was endowed such as chest plane 00:22:11.720 --> 00:22:15.357 which requires much more than any population. It seems to me that again we 00:22:15.390 --> 00:22:23.390 are, we are short uh, The development potential in the second assured we 00:22:23.420 --> 00:22:28.326 don't know what the computer eventually can be. Uh, 50 years from now. So 00:22:28.359 --> 00:22:31.157 we will have an old name. I'm sure really admit that automobiles the first 00:22:31.190 --> 00:22:35.157 couple of years they probably made statements about you know how great 00:22:35.190 --> 00:22:39.207 with time and 1000 miles an hour or something. But then there's the 00:22:39.240 --> 00:22:42.766 practical world of getting there. I think humanist tends to do that. I 00:22:42.799 --> 00:22:46.526 think it happened that it does that we see things, we try to see things 00:22:46.559 --> 00:22:52.607 make a hit and then reach for it. That's how it thinks. You see, I want to 00:22:52.640 --> 00:22:56.957 invent the computer which Crosby on computer and the first thing I want to 00:22:56.990 --> 00:23:01.597 drop his computer, it has to do with computation. I want to have analog 00:23:01.630 --> 00:23:06.677 for human genius and I'll call them general tests. Yeah. And I think if 00:23:06.710 --> 00:23:11.197 you start with this premise you have an altogether different scenario and 00:23:11.230 --> 00:23:15.336 you mentioned in passing the automobile, I think this may be a good and 00:23:15.369 --> 00:23:20.266 useful example for the attainable in spite of its 60 years did not improve 00:23:20.299 --> 00:23:24.776 beyond its original premise. If anything it brought about certain 00:23:24.809 --> 00:23:28.937 unresolved agony, signal disasters. So it has to be careful in saying that 00:23:28.970 --> 00:23:32.816 all technologies will perfect themselves and deliver something that was 00:23:32.849 --> 00:23:36.306 not religion in them. 00:23:36.339 --> 00:23:42.117 Henrik I'd like to ask a computer statement said Western technologies 00:23:42.150 --> 00:23:47.707 designed as an instrument of furthering Western values. How would you 00:23:47.740 --> 00:23:51.407 respond to the cool inside 00:23:51.440 --> 00:23:59.440 electronics really needs tranquilizing plan And it's a fundamental change 00:23:59.839 --> 00:24:07.839 muslim society First for me not to what is already Mhm And tribalism I 00:24:08.359 --> 00:24:12.897 think was a good slogan. And I think that when we look at the rate with 00:24:12.930 --> 00:24:16.177 which many cultures have been wiped out, we really don't want to try 00:24:16.210 --> 00:24:19.887 belies the planet because stabilization means home organization in Western 00:24:19.920 --> 00:24:24.137 patterns means really extinguishing many culture of making them so much 00:24:24.170 --> 00:24:29.147 like ourselves. The distinction and uh specific set of cultures and 00:24:29.180 --> 00:24:35.806 diversity of cultures disappear. Are we like our schools? Yeah, hold on. 00:24:35.839 --> 00:24:40.546 Well that's a good question. But I think that that terrible ization 00:24:40.579 --> 00:24:45.536 through electronic media really meant homogenization of other civilization 00:24:45.569 --> 00:24:49.276 culture into Western image. And I think that we are now becoming wiser and 00:24:49.309 --> 00:24:53.697 not to try to do it. And indeed we are trying to make ourselves like other 00:24:53.730 --> 00:24:59.246 culture more less homogeneous market. Virginia's more diverse, less linear 00:24:59.279 --> 00:25:06.276 and perhaps more inconsistent than the book. Yeah, yeah. Which one do you 00:25:06.309 --> 00:25:10.776 hear me understand her? To a plenty 00:25:10.809 --> 00:25:15.207 well it was creating a convolution. 00:25:15.240 --> 00:25:22.157 Mm We see it was printing another one of those technologies which allowed 00:25:22.190 --> 00:25:27.447 the mind of Man two to develop itself. I think it was the latter when I 00:25:27.480 --> 00:25:30.707 think about the first printings and when I think about some libraries in 00:25:30.740 --> 00:25:33.826 which some of the great books are still preserved. And I have specifically 00:25:33.859 --> 00:25:38.377 one image in mind Merton College Library at Oxford, one of the first 00:25:38.410 --> 00:25:44.256 libraries It was establishing 14 53 or something and there are some 14th 00:25:44.289 --> 00:25:48.717 century and 15th centuries volumes still chained as they were to the world. 00:25:48.750 --> 00:25:53.486 And when you look at it you thought my goodness, how poor they were. They 00:25:53.519 --> 00:25:57.496 had some 4050 books all chained big volumes. However, when you look at the 00:25:57.529 --> 00:26:01.486 content was Aristotle, there was requirements, there was played for the 00:26:01.519 --> 00:26:07.276 greatest books you can have together and consequently volume was small. 00:26:07.309 --> 00:26:11.907 But the content was great and I think that that complaint came about it 00:26:11.940 --> 00:26:15.486 was the bible and the greatest book that were ever written that went into 00:26:15.519 --> 00:26:18.726 printing and consequently it was the distribution of wisdom, not mere 00:26:18.759 --> 00:26:24.207 information we have the book. The book is not is not wisdom. The book is 00:26:24.240 --> 00:26:30.266 that device through which distributes the question was, is the electronic 00:26:30.299 --> 00:26:35.437 technology evil as in constant of the technology of the printing. Which is 00:26:35.470 --> 00:26:39.756 I don't know whether it's Evelyn, I deliberately restrained myself from 00:26:39.789 --> 00:26:44.296 you in those terms. Technologies, bad 00:26:44.329 --> 00:26:51.177 evil and all that. But okay, okay, let's be clear about it. I have always 00:26:51.210 --> 00:26:55.397 said to my insistence that there are certain values built into those 00:26:55.430 --> 00:26:58.726 technologies built into 00:26:58.759 --> 00:27:05.486 the media. Is the message brought into them. But and express the weapons 00:27:05.519 --> 00:27:09.286 and scale of values of the dominant culture and one has to be very careful 00:27:09.319 --> 00:27:14.117 analysis. Well, actually it is mutual, it is very free. It can be used by 00:27:14.150 --> 00:27:20.296 anybody for any purpose. So if you find it invariably there are only 00:27:20.329 --> 00:27:25.236 certain purposes, certain goals that are being distributed with it. You 00:27:25.269 --> 00:27:30.657 must really question your assumption that it is mutual and very free. You 00:27:30.690 --> 00:27:34.857 must really ask yourself whether it is not in the nature of the tool being 00:27:34.890 --> 00:27:40.836 devised by a sudden take the book. The book was an instrument for the very 00:27:40.869 --> 00:27:46.447 knowledgeable and very previous to carry on the north edge and appeals 00:27:46.480 --> 00:27:52.677 were looking at material plus windows and they were told that the books 00:27:52.710 --> 00:27:59.546 were saying this is the so it was monopolizing no way of going about times 00:27:59.579 --> 00:28:03.847 but acknowledged. It's also maybe you could say well the technology of the 00:28:03.880 --> 00:28:08.976 book at the beginning was that but that doesn't mean that the book was, 00:28:09.009 --> 00:28:12.167 was a way of multiple or monopolizing knowledge. And I would say the same 00:28:12.200 --> 00:28:18.006 thing for the technology. It was certainly used to monopolize knowledge 00:28:18.039 --> 00:28:21.276 and they will reveal between those who could read and track and those who 00:28:21.309 --> 00:28:24.276 couldn't. And this was the class division and then every possible 00:28:24.309 --> 00:28:31.266 deficient. And I think I was a bit cautious and kg because with books like 00:28:31.299 --> 00:28:36.117 with other cultural artifacts they have many days and the answer is not as 00:28:36.150 --> 00:28:43.306 simple because of the one hand, like the cathedral, it was a way of 00:28:43.339 --> 00:28:48.107 somehow coercing people to accept that most of the church 00:28:48.140 --> 00:28:52.736 here it was ground where have gone but on the other it was a very 00:28:52.769 --> 00:28:57.687 different uh subliminal kind of aesthetic and transcendent and spiritual 00:28:57.720 --> 00:29:02.927 education. And I cannot say that that was just a tool of domination of the 00:29:02.960 --> 00:29:07.006 oppression of the people. Which it was but they are transcendental 00:29:07.039 --> 00:29:11.417 purposes that were both into it. Somehow transcended to parallel was 00:29:11.450 --> 00:29:16.786 between the book which seems to be acceptable and the cloning device which 00:29:16.819 --> 00:29:19.897 seems to be less acceptable. I don't know whether I can find the book 00:29:19.930 --> 00:29:23.907 acceptable nowadays. Yeah. 00:29:23.940 --> 00:29:27.607 Well if you look at the history of the book though, through 400 years or 00:29:27.640 --> 00:29:35.640 so, I think you would agree with the idea that it's brought to us. Uh huh 00:29:36.269 --> 00:29:41.177 Information and knowledge and this first view points and so on. And 00:29:41.210 --> 00:29:47.296 generally speaking has been a constructive force. Yeah. Wouldn't you think 00:29:47.329 --> 00:29:51.937 that that the invention of printing and 00:29:51.970 --> 00:29:58.536 has brought overall a constructive force. But I am in a rebellious spirit 00:29:58.569 --> 00:30:03.967 this evening. And so I can go out and express my uh a selection against 00:30:04.000 --> 00:30:08.697 any proposition. And I think we should people in the audience stop because 00:30:08.730 --> 00:30:10.806 you're 00:30:10.839 --> 00:30:15.506 they came to express their We have only a few more minutes unless we want 00:30:15.539 --> 00:30:19.407 to go quite late in the evening. Which means also getting pretty cold. 00:30:19.440 --> 00:30:24.377 Yeah. So maybe 00:30:24.410 --> 00:30:32.107 a three voices from the audience so that they can house up uhh 00:30:32.140 --> 00:30:36.306 I have a question to ask 00:30:36.339 --> 00:30:39.707 said that 00:30:39.740 --> 00:30:45.006 mm hmm. Cosmos or whatever is moving towards a state of perfection. 00:30:45.039 --> 00:30:51.006 Earlier and earlier discussion with our seminar you said that 00:30:51.039 --> 00:30:59.039 the universe is not a stable or a steady state. Which is which is 00:31:01.039 --> 00:31:06.207 aesthetic. But it is a dynamic process is not being as I'm becoming it's 00:31:06.240 --> 00:31:11.726 becoming right. But if if and when this state of perfection comes about 00:31:11.759 --> 00:31:16.226 this would be a static state. Put it now. I mean it wouldn't be dynamic 00:31:16.259 --> 00:31:21.806 anymore. It would be stop. We stopped there and wouldn't go anywhere well 00:31:21.839 --> 00:31:24.607 and 00:31:24.640 --> 00:31:29.306 model remarkable beginning. 00:31:29.339 --> 00:31:37.339 Mhm 00:31:44.940 --> 00:31:52.940 Yeah. Mhm You're in person. What? 00:31:54.640 --> 00:31:57.806 Oh 00:31:57.839 --> 00:32:05.839 called more curious. Mhm Oh, bye here. 00:32:10.640 --> 00:32:16.607 So you did 00:32:16.640 --> 00:32:22.207 Well, problem there. Uh huh 00:32:22.240 --> 00:32:25.107 It has assumptions 00:32:25.140 --> 00:32:29.006 right? Is that? Mhm 00:32:29.039 --> 00:32:33.306 No. 00:32:33.339 --> 00:32:38.207 Mhm don't have it. No. Final. 00:32:38.240 --> 00:32:42.407 Not able to do what this Well, yes. 00:32:42.440 --> 00:32:47.506 Okay. The disadvantage. What 00:32:47.539 --> 00:32:51.607 And here we have 00:32:51.640 --> 00:32:54.506 scott. 00:32:54.539 --> 00:33:01.806 Yeah. Hold 00:33:01.839 --> 00:33:05.597 Yes. Thank you. 00:33:05.630 --> 00:33:08.607 Have you 00:33:08.640 --> 00:33:16.640 community with that condition like grabbing diplomacy's 00:33:18.539 --> 00:33:25.437 it's like saying that I uhh We get married. We can see we would like us to 00:33:25.470 --> 00:33:29.276 imagine what the baby we're going to make is going to behave 20 years from 00:33:29.309 --> 00:33:33.437 now. Well, we can imagine but we don't have we don't have a performance. 00:33:33.470 --> 00:33:37.276 So we can already say the baby is doing this and this and this very well 00:33:37.309 --> 00:33:41.177 try to do this and this and this. But since it's not there for the moment 00:33:41.210 --> 00:33:47.746 , we are, the best we can do is to conjecture and try to be very sensible 00:33:47.779 --> 00:33:55.779 conjecture. 00:34:09.139 --> 00:34:11.206 Okay, 00:34:11.239 --> 00:34:14.706 yeah, 00:34:14.739 --> 00:34:19.506 fashionable long. 00:34:19.539 --> 00:34:26.706 I try. 00:34:26.739 --> 00:34:34.739 It's like it's like but that comes we come back to the prophecy that could 00:34:35.199 --> 00:34:42.287 become so fulfilling. I don't I don't pretend to to prophetess, but it's 00:34:42.320 --> 00:34:47.537 in the same kind of frame of reference. If you believe enough in something 00:34:47.570 --> 00:34:52.836 and you struggle enough to realize this this which is I thought this has 00:34:52.869 --> 00:34:58.006 become could become a reality 00:34:58.039 --> 00:35:05.706 and science it tends to to accept places. 00:35:05.739 --> 00:35:12.106 Mhm. They have their statements from size that morley safer 00:35:12.139 --> 00:35:18.586 truth is not so much what is there, but what we are going, what we're will 00:35:18.619 --> 00:35:24.206 willing what we we are going to bills 00:35:24.239 --> 00:35:32.239 bye election. Truth is our world. Ladies and gentlemen, yeah, 00:35:43.639 --> 00:35:50.106 there's a couple of people in this production. I'd like to thank Kathleen 00:35:50.139 --> 00:35:58.139 Cafe, you know, her guests, Chartier, Henry Poole objectively called You 00:35:59.469 --> 00:36:02.006 can call the gas. 00:36:02.039 --> 00:36:09.606 Thank you and people involved this building. Some of them are 00:36:09.639 --> 00:36:12.407 thanks. 00:36:12.440 --> 00:36:17.407 Yeah. 00:36:17.440 --> 00:36:19.440 Mhm.